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Message: <blockquote data-quote="MoogleEmpMog" data-source="post: 2440058" data-attributes="member: 22882">Your stipulation is just plain wrong, though.Assume a 25 pt point buy, dwarf, human and hobgoblin fighters, all spending their points the same way.Dwarf: Str 14, Dex 14, Con 16, Int 10, Wis 13, Cha 6Hobgoblin: Str 14, Dex 16, Con 16, Int 10, Wis 13, Cha 8Human: Str 14, Dex 14, Con 14, Int 10, Wis 13, Cha 8Dwarf: 30 hpHobgoblin: 22 hpHuman: 27 hpDwarf: Dwarven Waraxe +5 melee (1d10+2/x3)Hobgoblin: Long Sword +4 melee (1d8+2/19-20)Human: Long Sword +5 melee (1d8+2/19-20)Dwarf: Longbow +5 ranged (1d8/x3)Hobgoblin: Longbow +5 ranged (1d8/x3)Human Longbow +5 ranged (1d8/x3)Dwarf: 4 featsHobgoblin: 3 featsHuman: 5 featsDwarf: AC 21 (+8 armor, +2 shield, +1 Dex)Hobgoblin: AC 21 (+8 armor, +2 shield, +1 Dex)Human: AC 21 (+8 armor, +2 shield, +1 Dex)Dwarf: 12 skill points, +8 situational skill bonusesHobgoblin: 10 skill points, +4 total skill bonusesHuman: 18 skill pointsDwarf: Fort +6 (+8 vs. magic or poison), Ref +3 (+5 vs. magic), Will +2 (+4 vs. magic)Hobgoblin: Fort +6, Ref +3, Will +1Human: Fort +5, Ref +3, Will +2Dwarf: Darkvision 60 ft., +4 AC vs. giants, +1 attack vs. orcs, gobs, Stability, move in armor, (-)land speed 20 ft.Hobgoblin: Darkvision 60 ft.Human: Favored Class: anyWith the LA, a hobgoblin fighter has one better Fort save than a human (same as a dwarf, except against magic and poison where it's 2 less) and darkvision (also same as a dwarf).  He loses, on average, +1 to hit in melee, 2 feats, 5 hp, 8 skill points, +1 Will save, and Favored Class (any).The hobgoblin's Dex and Move Silently bonuses probably won't benefit him one whit because as a fighter, he's more likely than not going to be wearing full plate by ECL 3 (a +4 Dex bonus would allow him to wear lighter armor and have the same AC; +2 does not), and the +1 to hit at range is counteracted by -1 BAB.At ECL 9, the hobgoblin finally catches up to the human in (average) hit points, as his Con bonus nets him 74 hp to the human's 73.  If both had put a 16 into Con before racial adjustments rather than a 14, the hobgoblin wouldn't take the lead until ECL 10.  Of course, the hobgoblin *never* catches the dwarf in hp, remaining an average of 8.5 hp behind his entire career.The hobgoblin typically qualifies for feats and Prestige Classes one level later than the human or dwarf.</blockquote>

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