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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Cadfan" data-source="post: 4911571" data-attributes="member: 40961">Yep.  You'll agree with me, at least on the nature of the law if not on its purpose or utility.  Did you know that you can even copyright arrangements and organizations of uncopyrightable material?  The copyright can be held in the organization rather than the underlying items organized.  Copyright is organic and resides almost everywhere that creativity is added to a system. And that's why I'm skeptical of the ability of a lay person to create a safe scrubbed copy of 4e.  It would have to 1. Scrub all of the obvious IP2. Scrub all of the nonobvious IP that most people don't know counts as IP3. Make decisions that avoid or survive legal challenge in the places where IP status is unclear4. Anticipate and avoid future changes to our relatively antiquated law of game IP5. And still end up with a usable, worthwhile copy of the game. And the person doing that would inevitably be someone with a strong ideological belief in a particular stance on intellectual property that is likely to be disagreed with heavily by established producers of intellectual property.  Such a person is likely to have difficulty working in an environment where the goal isn't to get things "right" in an ideological or even objective sense, but rather to get them "right" in the sense of "within the vaguely defined boundaries between two positions, each of which believe themselves to be right, close enough to the position of the other side that the other side doesn't feel moved to mount legal challenge."Because I game to enjoy myself, not to participate in an online community, and I can do that just fine without "giving back?" I don't know what else to say here about the whole moralizing aspect except that I don't believe you about your own motivations.  You repeatedly claim that you're not trying to make this into a moral issue, that its really just an issue of whether my actions benefit me, and my own self interest, but your language from the start has been peppered with morally weighted phrases and terminology.  You come across as a sort of camp counselor, explaining to a child that sharing is good for you AND me- an argument couched in self interest, but one through which the child no doubt sees.   From my reading, you clearly convey a moral take on the subject, and I believe my reading to be fair and reasonably objective.You should be ok.  If indeed this was posted by Posthuman or Catalyst, it ought to be scrubbed of the six copyrighted images, and therefore a completely legal, creative commons licensed download.  You didn't post a link, but if I am able to find and download a fully legal, distributable copy of Eclipse Phase, I'll come back and post it in this thread.  The only torrent I've checked so far isn't moving.</blockquote>

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