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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Mistwell" data-source="post: 7821741" data-attributes="member: 2525">I keep seeing this "without a save" as if that's the context here. You have to HIT. Spells are EITHER you have to hit OR you have to save. There is no meaningful difference really - either the player rolls a d20 and compares it to a target fixed number (AC), or a Foe rolls a d20 and compares it to a target fixed number (DC). So there is just as easy a way to avoid this attack as pretty much any other bog standard spell or attack.You have to hit. That's essentially the same as a save or an opposed check. It's still all just a d20 vs a target number, with the foe setting the target number with their AC.And if this somehow freaks you out, literally every single PC and foe can do the same thing without a cantrip at all. They can just grapple and shove! Or grapple and move you!Why is moving someone seen as overpowered somehow, after five years of this stuff and literally nobody ever saying anything like "wow forced movement is breaking my game" here, or the WOTC before they shut down, or on Reddit, or on FB, or anywhere?And why, when I asked for actual examples from real games where this did something meaningfully "overpowered" am I still getting theoretical responses? I think that's not a coincidence. I don't think it's all that powerful, and people are fretting over nothing. If I am wrong in that assumption, there should be a slew of people posting about it, for years now, because it's soooo common. levitate, dissonant whispers, telekinesis, Bigby's hand, thunderwave, etc.. there is just so much that forces foes to move. Why, all of a sudden, would this one be broken because it uses AC for the target fixed number instead of a fixed DC (or opposed roll)?</blockquote>

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