Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Eldritch Blast and Repelling Blast - One time or Each Hit?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="ClaytonCross" data-source="post: 7824304" data-attributes="member: 6880599"><p>If you use the shove action (PHB p195) in place of an attack, the targets does <strong>one</strong> contested skill test each push. A fighter can push 5 times in one round to push an enemy off a cliff. </p><p></p><p>Eldritch blast has to roll to hit contested by AC (to include shield spell and defensive abilities like Defensive Duelist) for <strong>one</strong> check to see it they are hit and the ability takes effect.</p><p></p><p>As a rule, Proficiency in Athletics or Acrobatics is more rare than a dissent AC because everyone has to be prepared in some way to take an attack but skills can be limited to about 4/18 and many players will look for something more flavorful. A Rogue scout might have four but could easily take, stealth, slight of hand, perception, and investigation in order to scout for traps and be a dirty thief. So as a dex based class that could be good at Acrobatics tests, they have a +5 to a random 1-20 roll do defend against a fighter who if they built with this in mind likely could have athletics for up to +11 for the same test. There is also a number of ways to get advantage on athletics tests and most of the rogue abilities like Evasion and uncanny dodge will not help the rogue vs a contested skill test. The same rogue with +5 from dex adds that to a stead AC17 and could also have static defensive bonuses like +1 -3 armor, a shield (buckler) +1-3, the Defensive Duelist for a reaction of +2-6 to AC and these are all pretty common. They could have an AC15 - AC27 with a reaction to raise it to AC33... depending on their investment on defense. </p><p></p><p>My point is every enemy is different but almost every player character and NPC has some level of defense making AC stronger against these types of attacks. So before I would consider nerfing Repelling blast which while it is a cantrip, is also a <strong>core part of the warlock class design</strong>, I would consider am I going to nerf fighters or barbarians trying to knock enemies off cliffs who have to do it in melee but have a greater chance of success? I would also consider @[USER=6906155]Paul Farquhar[/USER]'s two points. 1. "Creative use of the terrain is part of the game." and 2. "Moral: don't stand near the edges of cliffs". <strong>The implication of nerfing an ability clearly designed for this style of play and utility knowing that a player invested two core features of their class (Eldritch blast warlock spell and Eldritch invocation to add this feature) be cause of an off chance they use it strategically in a rare situation where it would actually work, gives me pause.</strong> In fact, I have played his warlock and it never game up in the campaign.. not once. Because we never fought in elevated terrain. Usually in caves, buildings, and level ground. <em>So I would be more inclined as GM to put NPC minions on the edge of cliffs just to encourage this style of play. To get warlocks, fighter, and barbarians throwing enemies off cliffs by any means at there disposal</em>. I would also through in a few casters with feather fall, teleport spells, fly, and polymorph.... because not everyone thrown off a cliff is going to die. These feels like an opportunity for me to expand my skill set as a GM use skills that I might not normally use in NPCs. It might be interesting to have a cliff battle with aarakocra, Protector Aasimar, Winged Tiefling Variant, or one of the 4 sorcerer subclasses that gain flight as an innate agility (AberrantMind, DivineSoul, DraconicBloodline, and StormSorcery). </p><p></p><p>I feel like saying, "this hurts my game" is often a restriction we put on our selves that can be fixed with "unless I....!!" which results in more fun and me binging a better GM that responds to players instead of surprising them from doing what they want.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="ClaytonCross, post: 7824304, member: 6880599"] If you use the shove action (PHB p195) in place of an attack, the targets does [B]one[/B] contested skill test each push. A fighter can push 5 times in one round to push an enemy off a cliff. Eldritch blast has to roll to hit contested by AC (to include shield spell and defensive abilities like Defensive Duelist) for [B]one[/B] check to see it they are hit and the ability takes effect. As a rule, Proficiency in Athletics or Acrobatics is more rare than a dissent AC because everyone has to be prepared in some way to take an attack but skills can be limited to about 4/18 and many players will look for something more flavorful. A Rogue scout might have four but could easily take, stealth, slight of hand, perception, and investigation in order to scout for traps and be a dirty thief. So as a dex based class that could be good at Acrobatics tests, they have a +5 to a random 1-20 roll do defend against a fighter who if they built with this in mind likely could have athletics for up to +11 for the same test. There is also a number of ways to get advantage on athletics tests and most of the rogue abilities like Evasion and uncanny dodge will not help the rogue vs a contested skill test. The same rogue with +5 from dex adds that to a stead AC17 and could also have static defensive bonuses like +1 -3 armor, a shield (buckler) +1-3, the Defensive Duelist for a reaction of +2-6 to AC and these are all pretty common. They could have an AC15 - AC27 with a reaction to raise it to AC33... depending on their investment on defense. My point is every enemy is different but almost every player character and NPC has some level of defense making AC stronger against these types of attacks. So before I would consider nerfing Repelling blast which while it is a cantrip, is also a [B]core part of the warlock class design[/B], I would consider am I going to nerf fighters or barbarians trying to knock enemies off cliffs who have to do it in melee but have a greater chance of success? I would also consider @[USER=6906155]Paul Farquhar[/USER]'s two points. 1. "Creative use of the terrain is part of the game." and 2. "Moral: don't stand near the edges of cliffs". [B]The implication of nerfing an ability clearly designed for this style of play and utility knowing that a player invested two core features of their class (Eldritch blast warlock spell and Eldritch invocation to add this feature) be cause of an off chance they use it strategically in a rare situation where it would actually work, gives me pause.[/B] In fact, I have played his warlock and it never game up in the campaign.. not once. Because we never fought in elevated terrain. Usually in caves, buildings, and level ground. [I]So I would be more inclined as GM to put NPC minions on the edge of cliffs just to encourage this style of play. To get warlocks, fighter, and barbarians throwing enemies off cliffs by any means at there disposal[/I]. I would also through in a few casters with feather fall, teleport spells, fly, and polymorph.... because not everyone thrown off a cliff is going to die. These feels like an opportunity for me to expand my skill set as a GM use skills that I might not normally use in NPCs. It might be interesting to have a cliff battle with aarakocra, Protector Aasimar, Winged Tiefling Variant, or one of the 4 sorcerer subclasses that gain flight as an innate agility (AberrantMind, DivineSoul, DraconicBloodline, and StormSorcery). I feel like saying, "this hurts my game" is often a restriction we put on our selves that can be fixed with "unless I....!!" which results in more fun and me binging a better GM that responds to players instead of surprising them from doing what they want. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Eldritch Blast and Repelling Blast - One time or Each Hit?
Top