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Message: <blockquote data-quote="ValhallaGH" data-source="post: 5463348" data-attributes="member: 41187">Right.  IF the DM uses the interaction skills <a href="http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/diplomacy.htm" target="_blank">as written</a>, and IF the DM allows time for solutions other than slaughter to be attempted, THEN Bluff and Diplomacy are "I WIN D&D"."Make hostile creature helpful.  DC 50 Diplomacy.  At least 1 minute of interaction."If they Players choose a reasonable opening phrase, in the mind of their foes, it behooves the INTELLIGENT DM to let them continue to speak until they really muck it up.  If they don't muck it up (and some of them won't) then they will have had enough interaction time to justify a Diplomacy check.  If they have a +20 and roll well (15+) then they will make their foe FRIENDLY.  Friendly creatures don't fight you, as they wish you well and will offer limited advice and help (from their perspective); yes, being friendly may mean the lich offers to turn you into a vampire or other powerful undead, trying to persuade you, his friends, that it is the wise and right choice, but he's no longer actively trying to kill the party.Bluff is equally potent, especially used as a set-up for Diplomacy.  A successful bluff can provide time for a non-slaughter solution.Which means that the INTELLIGENT DM only has three options.  1) Change the interaction skill rules, so that these options work differently.  2) Disallow all non-slaughter solutions, forcing the campaign to pure hack & slash.  3) Use mindless foes (or <a href="http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/skills.htm#diplomacy" target="_blank">fanatics</a>) that cannot be talked to; which is just a variant of #2.Prove me wrong.  Please.</blockquote>

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