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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Old Gumphrey" data-source="post: 3562855" data-attributes="member: 12872">Oh noes you mean a mage wearing a mithral shirt is just as good as a mage with Mage Armor? Broken! <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />Why not a shield? *shrug* Don't forget the -5 full plate ACP. Toting a mithral buckler has 0% ASF and has been a long time twink for mage players, so that is nothing new to me.Let's pretend that the mage's entire cash flow is in these two items (to see the lowest level this is possible, which is about 2k higher than 10th, so about what you'd look like one session after hitting 10th in an actual game). Then we're going to give another mage actual mage items and see how that looks.+5 full plate: -5 ACP (very painful whether you believe it or not), costs 26,650 gp. +13 AC+5 heavy shield: -1  ACP, costs 25,170 gp. +7 ACSo this guy has -6 to all rolls, plus he has to prepare special spells just to make sure he doesn't die from climbing or jumping. Nobody's going to carry his metal-covered ass, either. Nothing to boost his mage abilities, but he's got an (impressive) +20 AC, giving him a max AC of 31 before any AC buffs (only one I can think of that would work is Haste).Meanwhile Mage B has a rod of Lesser Maximize (14k), Lesser Empower (9k), Lesser Extend (3k), Headband of Intellect +4 (16k), and a Ring of Protection +2 (8k).So this guy has no penalties at all, plus extra spells and another +2 to his save DCs. His greater mage armor lasts for 20 hours with no level adjustment. He can throw a 37 point magic missile, a 90-point fireball, and a 90-point lightning bolt with no level adjustment. After a quickened shield at the start of a fight, this guy's working with a 24 AC. Significantly less than Mage A, but he has more spells per day, higher DCs, and 3 of his damage spells each day are EXTREMELY powerful.Still not seeing the problem.</blockquote>

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