Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Enchanted Trinkets Complete--a hardcover book containing over 500 magic items for your D&D games!

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="ARandomGod" data-source="post: 2787333" data-attributes="member: 17296">Ah, well, if that's what you read into my response that's clearly a point of miscommunication, as that's not what I was attempting to say.  Just the opposite, in fact. Of course, in the main I was asking more specifically what had been said, but if there's an errata or a clarification it DOES matter. Now, I do admit that I was saying that if there was an errata on Knockdown, and Knockdown used similiar language pre-errata, then that lends support to my opinion that Elusive target would 'need' an errata too, if we were to disallow making an attack after the trip attempt (per Improved Trip) that Elusive Target granted.Well, OK, I will own that partially. Although I didn't state that it does not matter so much as I expressed the opinion that an errata on Knockdown disallowing an attack after the trip actually strengthens the opinion that Elusive Target would grant the attack after the trip.I do state that ignoring the "as if" clause does not change the rules, because the clause itself is a clarification that it does grant the attack ANYWAY... and indeed that "as if" something is would be very similiar to something actually BEING< and the Imp Trip stated as if they hadn't used an attack to trip, whereas Elusive Target actually IS not having used a trip attempt....Ahem.Onwards. This errata of Knockdown. Now, Knockdown basically switches Improved Trip around. Using Knockdown you:1) Make an attack2) If the attack fails, stop3) If the attack is successful, and deals at least X (10HP?) damage, proceed4) Make a trip attempt free. Whereas Improved Trip is the opposite1) Make a trip attempt2) If trip attempt fails, stop3) If trip attempt succeeds, proceed4) Make an attack.Since the Knockdown Feat requires Improved Trip in the first place (I'm going by memory here, I could be wrong about this part ... I'm pretty sure I'm not, but I should be IMO, after all, it seems to me to be actually less powerful than Improved Trip), and it does not generate any extra attacks... it instead modifies Improved Trip, it makes sense (to me) that it would not allow a follow-up atteck to be made.The fact that they made this errate for Knockdown means they felt the wording of Knockdown supported a belief that Knockdown, as it was worded, did indeed allow a follow up attack after the trip that was given for free by the attack. Which leads to the belief that the similiar wording of Elusive Target also allows a follow up attack after the trip.However, Elusive Target only grants a 1)Trip ..... which with Improved Trip would follow up with a generated 2) Attack.So this combo yields a 1) Trip attempt 2) Attack if successful.... with TWO feats.Knockdown without the errata would have yielded with ONE feat a 1)Trip attempt after a normal attack 2) follow up attack after the first attack.So the errata on Knockdown was to stop people from getting in two attacks from a trip. The Elusive Target combined with Improved Trip only generates ONE attack from a trip.</blockquote>

Verification