Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Elves, Dwarves, Gnomes and Halflings of Color
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Dire Bare" data-source="post: 8349746" data-attributes="member: 18182"><p>Unearthly beauty is certainly one of the defining traits of many a mythological creature, including nymphs and elves. Just as ugliness defines other creatures. As does gender sometimes, as nymphs and valkyries usually being portrayed as female. Beauty is almost always associated with goodly creatures, although not always, and sometimes stories get a little more complex . . . or that goodly beauty has a dark side of viciousness. Ugliness is often associated with evil, although again, not always. Hags/witches are particular problematic, combing ugliness, age, and feminization as an evil combo!</p><p></p><p>If we decide to change some of those associations, we do end up changing the D&D race/monster . . . and it's easy to feel that these changes aren't needed, it's only fantasy, etc, etc. But I think taking a close look at all sorts of D&D races and monsters and reimagining some of them to move away from problematic stereotypes serves us well in the long term. As we reexamine these various creatures, we won't all agree on what needs changed, and it's a lot of work. But again, I think the conversations and the thought processes are worth having.</p><p></p><p>This is complicated when D&D adapts a mythological creature, and in doing so changes the role of that creature! If an elf is some sort of nature spirit, then is it okay for it to hold unearthly beauty and be largely considered good, if mischievous? But does that still hold if elves are now a mortal race, on par with humans?</p><p></p><p>As we change our ideas of how the game deals with race (sentient creatures), how important is <em>mythological accuracy</em>? Especially when so many <em>myth-inspired</em> D&D creatures aren't all that accurate before we do any revising! And of course, we are taking folkloric elements from oral traditions that were anything but consistent within cultures, and similar creatures could vary significantly between cultures. Fey/elves/fairies are a good example of that.</p><p></p><p>One of these days I want to write up a supplement de-coupling hags from the ugliness/female/old trifecta equating to evil . . . . but even I have a hard time imagining a good-looking, young, male hag! Although the hag-born (hexblood) lineage in the new Ravenloft book actually moves in that direction . . . you can be of any age, any gender, and any level of attractiveness and be a hexblood, or hag-lite. Or maybe you just have to break some of those associations . . . maybe all hags are ugly by human standards, but they aren't human, and they don't see themselves as ugly or evil . . .</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Dire Bare, post: 8349746, member: 18182"] Unearthly beauty is certainly one of the defining traits of many a mythological creature, including nymphs and elves. Just as ugliness defines other creatures. As does gender sometimes, as nymphs and valkyries usually being portrayed as female. Beauty is almost always associated with goodly creatures, although not always, and sometimes stories get a little more complex . . . or that goodly beauty has a dark side of viciousness. Ugliness is often associated with evil, although again, not always. Hags/witches are particular problematic, combing ugliness, age, and feminization as an evil combo! If we decide to change some of those associations, we do end up changing the D&D race/monster . . . and it's easy to feel that these changes aren't needed, it's only fantasy, etc, etc. But I think taking a close look at all sorts of D&D races and monsters and reimagining some of them to move away from problematic stereotypes serves us well in the long term. As we reexamine these various creatures, we won't all agree on what needs changed, and it's a lot of work. But again, I think the conversations and the thought processes are worth having. This is complicated when D&D adapts a mythological creature, and in doing so changes the role of that creature! If an elf is some sort of nature spirit, then is it okay for it to hold unearthly beauty and be largely considered good, if mischievous? But does that still hold if elves are now a mortal race, on par with humans? As we change our ideas of how the game deals with race (sentient creatures), how important is [I]mythological accuracy[/I]? Especially when so many [I]myth-inspired[/I] D&D creatures aren't all that accurate before we do any revising! And of course, we are taking folkloric elements from oral traditions that were anything but consistent within cultures, and similar creatures could vary significantly between cultures. Fey/elves/fairies are a good example of that. One of these days I want to write up a supplement de-coupling hags from the ugliness/female/old trifecta equating to evil . . . . but even I have a hard time imagining a good-looking, young, male hag! Although the hag-born (hexblood) lineage in the new Ravenloft book actually moves in that direction . . . you can be of any age, any gender, and any level of attractiveness and be a hexblood, or hag-lite. Or maybe you just have to break some of those associations . . . maybe all hags are ugly by human standards, but they aren't human, and they don't see themselves as ugly or evil . . . [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Elves, Dwarves, Gnomes and Halflings of Color
Top