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Message: <blockquote data-quote="fusangite" data-source="post: 815196" data-attributes="member: 7240">As to your request for name, I've come up with a few names for the key noble families: Kelvin, Kelkios, Franhaig, Oghn and Vuelth.Thanks a lot. There's now an update to the history which I think you might be helpful.Due to the, in my view misplaced, support for the Lady Kelvin theory of government, I have had to modify this. I've therefore used Lalato's idea that the Kelvins have always had title to the city and that Kelvin is one of the names of the herder clans. I hope this doesn't mess things up too badly. This looks great and fits into the history just fine. Can you expand this into story form? I'd like to have this as one of the legends/stories which makes up the history document.This all seems good. I've left the actual power of the Kelvins and the structure of government as nebulous as I can. A couple of issues worth pointing out, though, are:1. Can the country gentry work the same way in a primarily pastoral rather than agricultural economy? I had kind of imagined that the herders were still working in a non-vassalage-based medieval society like the Scots.2. The island on which the citadel stands is Kelvin territory; it looks like it might be useful to figure out which noble families hold which lands in the city and its environs. It seems to me that much of the specific governance structure can flow from this. I have an idea that there should be a small number of privileged Enorian clans with guaranteed seats on the council. I'd love it if you could integrate this paragraph directly into the section of the history dealing with the first sack.Generally I like this. However, my history sort of works off the idea that the dwarves have a more significant and longer-standing relationship with the city.This all looks fine. I'm thinking the elves could be immigrants from the shores of Lake Enoria who moved to the city as a direct consequence of the silk fishing industry. Again, this looks great.Maybe the muster should be a Kelvinic institution rather than a Mor's End one. How would that sit with you? I rather like the idea of the city as a subset of the Kelvinic lands rather than vice-versa.Speaking of the merchants' council, what do you think of my idea of two competing merchant associations? I think I posted it in the guilds thread. I'm not a big fan of this idea. Because of the times we live in, we often come up with governance structures that are inappropriately representative. I don't think that the nobles should ever have to sit in the same assembly as non-nobles. So here's my wacky state theory for for Mor's End:0. the House Kelvin has title to Mor's End and has chartered the city. I sort of see the following political units (from largest to smallest):1. Enheim -- a loose confederation of herder clans that assemble once a year for a big celebration/meeting sometimes camped outside Mor's End sometimes elsewhere in Enheim. This confederation would have an honourary king-type position with little power and a Dux Bellorum (King Arthur's job -- Duke of War) who will command the clans of Enheim in the event of invasion.2. Lords' Lands -- the lands controlled by the clans; these lands have little real government except for a vassalage arrangement with the Kelvins which requires the annual muster and a tribute in sheep and gold.3. Mor's End -- a city chartered by the Kelvins which has grown to encompass some lands from the Vuelths, Antells, Harrowdales and other noble families. Most governing is by the castellan and his officials or by organizations like wards, guilds and cults to which the castellan has delegated his powers.4. The Wards -- most governing is done at the ward level. However, someone living in a ward can be subject to one of six types of law: (a) laws can be made by the castellan and his advisors that apply to all wards of the city; (b) the warden of each ward (selected by a different procedure in each ward -- elected, appointed, hereditary etc.) (c) the noble family on whose lands the ward sits (the Kelvins, Antells, Vuelths, etc.) (my idea is that each ward is wholly within a single noble's territories) can make laws for the whole of their lands (d) guilds, cults, etc. can make laws that affect their members (e) the Kelvins can make laws applying generally to the whole city (f) the the Dux Bellorum or High King of Enheim can make laws for the whole regionI'd like it if the boundaries of jurisdictions were disputed, overlapping and unclear. This system makes it seem like the Lords are subordinate to the council. I don't like the idea of the Lords meeting collectively; if they have to send representatives to anything, they should do so individually based on their rights as noble families.I'd prefer a city council wholly appointed by the castellan or appointed in part by the castellan and in part by the ward governments. I think the way for nobles to have power in this system should be their own direct assertion of jurisdiction not their involvement in a representative process.I think Lady Kelvin should just make whatever laws she feels like.The problem here is that there is not enough potential for abuse. This city isn't supposed to be a place of justice and order, is it?Your system sounds strangely... American. I also had to drop the term "duke" in my second draft. This list of council members looks great.I agree heartily.I like this idea; I think Harrowdale would be a more complex and strange figure if his presence on council flouted tradition, though.I love all this stuff. Great work.Anyway, feel free to throw out my alternate theory of the city. I like your ideas about the specifics of the city council and what it does. I'd just prefer the city to be a chaotic mass of overlapping jurisdictions rather than a relatively flat, representative system.Great work. I look forward to working further with you.</blockquote>

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