"End Bosses"

[Gundark]

In my game when the players confront the "End Boss" he/she/group/monster is usually at an EL that is higher than the group. I usually aim for an EL that is usually 3 above the party level. I have been finding lately that this isn't enough (4 players levels 8-9). What is the EL difference for your "End Bosses" (doesn't have to be one guy/creature, it could be many)? Does that gap stay the same as your PCs progress? Let me know.

 

[Gregor]

I try for an EL of about 2 - 3 higher than the party average. Either way, I find that if I am using a single boss (cleric, sorcerer etc) they generally get smoked despite the difference in EL. This could be due to improper spell choice or tactics or whatever on my part as the DM. I want to try and use a group or party of bad guys as the boss fight. That way, although I will have many lower level baddies as opposed to one uber baddy, I can take advantage of flanking, sneak attacks etc and it removes the concentration of damage off the one guy. Actually now that I think about it.....it could also be that I am a spineless puppy DM who spares his players

 

[Vanye]

I try for an EL of about 2 - 3 higher than the party average. Either way, I find that if I am using a single boss (cleric, sorcerer etc) they generally get smoked despite the difference in EL. This could be due to improper spell choice or tactics or whatever on my part as the DM. I want to try and use a group or party of bad guys as the boss fight. That way, although I will have many lower level baddies as opposed to one uber baddy, I can take advantage of flanking, sneak attacks etc and it removes the concentration of damage off the one guy. Actually now that I think about it.....it could also be that I am a spineless puppy DM who spares his players

Probably a combination of the two, actually. I too am a bit easy on the players, because we're there to have fun, but when you've got one bad guy vs (in my case) 6 characters, they're going to go down real easy like. My current plans all have at least two minions with the bad guy, even if they're several cr's lower, just to divide some of the PC's attentions...

 

[s/LaSH]

I tend to use +10CR (or higher) things. Then again, I never planned for them to lose... which made the mummy-priest fight on the Elemental Plane of Water an interesting event, because they nearly beat him, despite the 15-level difference. And the fact that most of them were unconscious.

 

[Teflon Billy]

I never have "Level Bosses" as it seems a little to closely akin to the Computer Game mentality I play tabletop RPG's to avoid.

 

[Al'Kelhar]

I don't use CRs. However, the "bad guy at the end of the adventure" is seldom much higher level than the PCs. Always, always, have minions. Smart bad guys do not fight on their own unless the PCs have outsmarted them - in which case, the PCs have done their job well and should be rewarded by a relatively easy fight.

As a rule, in an heroic final battle, I tend to have the adventure bad guy around the same level as the PCs, with one minion per PC who can last two or three rounds in battle against one PC. Use simple no-brainer combat tactics like never letting the PCs focus their attention on the BBEG - split their forces and concentrate your own. By having one BBEG against numerous PCs, you break this cardinal rule of warfare, and no BBEG with Int of 10 or more is going to permit it to happen. The BBEGs who are so arrogant that they think they can take on a whole party of PCs are the BBEGs who die - in which case, how did they become BBEGs in the first place?

Cheers, Al'Kelhar

 

[EricNoah]

Typically my big bad guy is 3-4 levels above the average party member, plus has support allies to harrass at a distance, some method of putting some distance between himself and harm, and some long-range artilery (either spells or a magic item). Plus I like the terrain in the big ending battle to be varied and provide both challenges and potential resources (cover, ledges to push the bad guys off of, etc.).

 

[Dimwhit]

I don't know the make up of that group, but we've discovered something very interesting. There is a period of levels for characters where they are extremely powerful compared to similar ELs. It's right around the 8th-12th level range. At those levels, in pretty much all our campaigns, we were walking through of our Encounter Levels and even a little higher. Flattens back out at the higher levels for us, though. My experience? 4 characters of 8-9th level, I'd throw an EL 12 or 13 at them. With some backups in case it's going really badly for the bad guys.

 

[Endur]

It kind of depends. In Living Greyhawk, a table of 6 players customarily faces ELs about 4 higher than the party.

In other games, we tend to make bosses a little bit tougher than the party.

With regards to minions vs. single boss, a single combatant is usually vulnerable, particularly if a PC race. If not a PC race, that might be different. Vampires, Dragons, and similar creatures were built more powerful than PCs because they are intended to be all alone as a boss creature.

I try to vary encounter ELs from 4 below the party to 4 above the party. If the encounter EL is more than 4 below the party, the bad guys/victims just flee in terror or negotiate. If more than 4 higher than the party, hopefully the party will flee in terror or negotiate. I also don't go straight off ELs, but look carefully at what the party is capable of. Since the ELs are often not indicative of a threat's true danger to the party.