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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Hypersmurf" data-source="post: 3046708" data-attributes="member: 1656">Indeed.How so?I'm not referring to the special attack rules or the normal combat rules; they're not relevant, beyond the fact that the special attack allows for the possibility of 'a successful hit'.I'm simply referring to the weapon rules, which, like the Flaming ability, notes that damage is dealt on 'a successful hit'.  Not on 'a successful hit with a normal melee attack' or 'a successful hit except when tripping'.Trips as a special attack don't deliver weapon damage by virtue of being a Trip, no.  But weapons deliver weapon damage on a successful hit, and Trips allow for a successful hit with a weapon.If the Trip rules were to state "The weapon deals no damage", there'd be a case for a specific rule taking precedence.  But rather, the Trip rules are silent on the matter of damage, which means the only rule we have to adjudicate the matter is found under Weapons - they deal the indicated damage on a successful hit.You state "normal combat/weapon rules" as though it's a single entity.  Combat is a separate chapter to Equipment.  The rule that weapons deal the indicated damage on a successful hit is as separate a rules section to Combat as Magic Weapon Special Abilities is.The wording is the same.  The separateness of the rules sections is the same.  One can't in good conscience argue that the readings are different.  If a flaming weapon deals +1d6 extra fire damage on a successful hit when tripping, then a flail deals 1d8 damage on a successful hit when tripping.  To argue that one is true but not the other is inconsistent.-Hyp.</blockquote>

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