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ENnies voting methodology
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<blockquote data-quote="anonystu" data-source="post: 999235" data-attributes="member: 10897"><p>Cool! I should have had more faith that Morrus would be a wise fellow about this. I've forwarded him the link to the Bayesian estimate thing already. If I think of anything else, I'll be sure to pass it along. </p><p></p><p>Maybe also some collective enworld thought could help, so I'll post my initial thoughts here:</p><p></p><p>There are two main issues that I can think of, but no good answers off hand:</p><p></p><p>1) Do you attempt to detect or remove people who try to spike votes?</p><p></p><p>I'm not talking at this point about people who attempt to get around IP limitaitons, or do other sorts of blatant attempts at cheating, because those should be stopped pretty clearly, but rather, if a vote comes across where every category has one product at 10, and four products at 1, do you accept these as a casualty of the voting system, or do you try to mediate the person's attempt to make their vote count "more" somehow? Note that the solution to this may exist by answering the next question.</p><p></p><p>2) Can you do anything other than averages?</p><p></p><p>Consider these three scenarios:</p><p>Product A is the only product in a category to get a vote: it gets a 6.</p><p></p><p>Product A gets a 6, and Product B gets a 3, no other products get votes.</p><p></p><p>Product A gets a 6, Product B gets a 7, Product C gets a 8, Product D gets 9, and Product E gets a 10.</p><p></p><p>Is each 6 the same six? It's easy to see how you'd like to view those sixes in different lights, but it's tricky. It is my opinion, the greatest strength of this voting system (that it encourages you to only report on products you know), that makes it hardest here: there are lots of viable systems I could think of if everybody was required to vote on all products.</p><p></p><p>However, the benefit in honesty (in that I can just report on what I've seen), is so much bigger than any silly rank-order.</p><p></p><p></p><p>c) Can Morrus ethically change the voting tabulaiton system mid vote, or after vote?</p><p></p><p>My initial statement was slightly overbroad: there are a few ways where you can ethically do this, in my humble opinion.</p><p></p><p>1) If Morrus hasn't had any exposure to the votes, it's fine.</p><p>2) If Morrus has only had very limited and peculiar exposure to the votes, it's still fine (For example, if he only glances by IP addresses to check to make sure that people aren't spamming).</p><p>3) If Morrus looks at the votes without knowing what votes go where, it's fine.</p><p>4) If Morrus looks at small sample sizes, it's still okay, because it's hard to know how the race will go from a small sample size (although small is small: more than 30 or so votes looked at it in a category will probably give you a good idea of a distribution).</p><p></p><p>Obviously, even if he's not following these guidelines, Morrus is a good guy: I trust him not to monkey with the parameters to make his secret organization take over the world (or if he does, at the least, offer me a cool glass of water first). These are more general guidelines, on how altering rankings should go.</p><p></p><p>Hmm. That's a start for any armchair statisticians like myself.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="anonystu, post: 999235, member: 10897"] Cool! I should have had more faith that Morrus would be a wise fellow about this. I've forwarded him the link to the Bayesian estimate thing already. If I think of anything else, I'll be sure to pass it along. Maybe also some collective enworld thought could help, so I'll post my initial thoughts here: There are two main issues that I can think of, but no good answers off hand: 1) Do you attempt to detect or remove people who try to spike votes? I'm not talking at this point about people who attempt to get around IP limitaitons, or do other sorts of blatant attempts at cheating, because those should be stopped pretty clearly, but rather, if a vote comes across where every category has one product at 10, and four products at 1, do you accept these as a casualty of the voting system, or do you try to mediate the person's attempt to make their vote count "more" somehow? Note that the solution to this may exist by answering the next question. 2) Can you do anything other than averages? Consider these three scenarios: Product A is the only product in a category to get a vote: it gets a 6. Product A gets a 6, and Product B gets a 3, no other products get votes. Product A gets a 6, Product B gets a 7, Product C gets a 8, Product D gets 9, and Product E gets a 10. Is each 6 the same six? It's easy to see how you'd like to view those sixes in different lights, but it's tricky. It is my opinion, the greatest strength of this voting system (that it encourages you to only report on products you know), that makes it hardest here: there are lots of viable systems I could think of if everybody was required to vote on all products. However, the benefit in honesty (in that I can just report on what I've seen), is so much bigger than any silly rank-order. c) Can Morrus ethically change the voting tabulaiton system mid vote, or after vote? My initial statement was slightly overbroad: there are a few ways where you can ethically do this, in my humble opinion. 1) If Morrus hasn't had any exposure to the votes, it's fine. 2) If Morrus has only had very limited and peculiar exposure to the votes, it's still fine (For example, if he only glances by IP addresses to check to make sure that people aren't spamming). 3) If Morrus looks at the votes without knowing what votes go where, it's fine. 4) If Morrus looks at small sample sizes, it's still okay, because it's hard to know how the race will go from a small sample size (although small is small: more than 30 or so votes looked at it in a category will probably give you a good idea of a distribution). Obviously, even if he's not following these guidelines, Morrus is a good guy: I trust him not to monkey with the parameters to make his secret organization take over the world (or if he does, at the least, offer me a cool glass of water first). These are more general guidelines, on how altering rankings should go. Hmm. That's a start for any armchair statisticians like myself. [/QUOTE]
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