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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Elder-Basilisk" data-source="post: 2400185" data-attributes="member: 3146">I was going to say grease but someone beat me to the punch. Command can do a number on low will save foes like hill giants though. "Flee" should be good for at least two rounds since the hill giant needs to take time to move back to where he was. True Strike combined with a tanglefoot bag also works pretty well. Even the lowly color spray is able to take out a hill giant for a few rounds (stunned for one round then provokes an AoO when he picks up his greatclub). If you move down the line to creatures like ogres and such, sleep and cause fear kick in as well.As for wholesale slaughter of PCs, I've seen food (or lack thereof) be key to the disastrous misadventures of several groups of PCs who didn't buy any (or who didn't buy much). I've heard of sleep being devastating to groups of low-level PCs too. Especially at low levels, there are so many things capable of slaughtering PCs wholesale that the ability to do that doesn't prove entangle to be broken. That said, it's important to realize that different things can be broken for NPCs than for PCs. For instance, PCs have to try to create situations where pyrotechnics will be useful. Sometimes they can and sometimes they can't. However, if the NPCs are planning a midnight attack on the PCs and they know the PCs use torches or a campfire, they can guarantee that the spell will be useful. Similarly, PCs can expect to fight creatures with a mix of HD so spells like cause fear and scare may or may not be useful after the first few levels. A 3rd level NPC, however, has no need to fear that PCs (other than paladins) will be immune to his scare spell. He knows he'll get to use it. This is doubly true of home-game encounters that can be planned with a specific group of PCs in mind. At a convention game or in a written module, there's a much better chance that NPCs will be planning tactics that don't take the barbarian/cleric with the travel domain or the party of 5 archers (an archer cleric, a barbarian who carries a bow, an elf wizard with point blank and precise shot, a fighter archer, and a scout who carries a bow as his primary weapon) who actually prefer not to have to close to melee range.That I'll agree with. Druids are broken. But I don't think it's entangle that makes them broken.</blockquote>

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