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<blockquote data-quote="Jemal" data-source="post: 5545452" data-attributes="member: 9026"><p>Vertex - I believe the thing you're refering to is if a skill is on a creatures skill list it's a racial skill for them. Don't recall racial bonuses giving class skills (Otherwise all elves would have Spot/listen, all halflings would have Hide/move silent/listen, All Half-elves would have diplomacy, etc..)</p><p></p><p>If you want to simplify things, (and your base rase is human) I'd suggest the Able Learner feat, it makes all skills cost 1 skill point regardless of cc or not.. Which means all you have to figure out at Epic is if a skill was a class skill for ANY of your classes. If so, its 1/rank and max as a class skill=HD+3. If not, it's 1/rank and max as a cc skill=(HD+3)/2.</p><p></p><p></p><p>And in regards to the Geomancer, I've done some work on my sublime chord, and allthough he's infinitely more complicated, he's also a LOT more fun, and I've allready got lots of backstory for him and his rod.. er, perhaps I should rephrase that.. You see, he has a magical stick that.. wait, wait..</p><p>I gave him an Intelligent Item, which is also an epic 1.6Million(Not counting intelligent cost) multi-purpose Rod. I knew I had to use the sublime chord over the wearbear when I realized I'd had more fun making the Rod, it's purpose, its personality, and their combined backstory than I did making the bear. Heck, I even added in Rod of Lordly might and Immovable Rod to its powers simply b/c they fit with it's Stubborn/Regal Personality! I love it when stuff like that happens <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin :D" data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" /></p><p></p><p>Anyways, here's the dirty I've got so far. It was originally copied from a lvl 20 sorc, so there may be some things I missed in the changing. And I've yet to finish his spell selection, so it's not included (He casts as a lvl 6 bard, Full Sublime Chord, Full Wu Jen).</p><p></p><p>Gotta head to work but will post up backstory next time.</p><p></p><p>[sblock=The Messenger]</p><p>Human Bard2/Paladin2/Wu Jen3/Ultimate Magus 10/Mindbender1/Lyric Thaumaturge 5/E.Knight1/Sublime Chord 1/Magical Trickster3/Archmage2</p><p>*First 20 lvls = Bard2/Paladin2/WuJen3/Magus6/Sublime1/Mindbender1/Knight1/Lyric4</p><p>AL: CG HT: 5'11" WT: 150 Hair: Red with Silver Highlights Eyes: Sea-green</p><p></p><p>{91 Points *+1 for guessing near-correct on hundred headed hydra*}</p><p>STR: 10 (+0) [10 Points]</p><p>DEX: 30 (+10) [15 Points +5 Inherent +6 Enhancement +4 Sacred]</p><p>CON: 28 (+9) [17 Points +5 Inherent +6 Enhancement]</p><p>INT: 28 (+9) [18 Points +4 Inherent +6 Enhancement]</p><p>WIS: 24 (+7) [13 Points +5 Inherent +6 Enhancement]</p><p>CHA: 40 (+15) [18 Points + 7 level +5 Inherent +6 Enhancement +4 Sacred]</p><p></p><p>HP: (3d10+11d6+16d4+270) AC: 58 (10 base +10 dex +12 Armour +6 Shield +5 Nat.Armour + 15 Deflection)</p><p>Saves: </p><p>FORT: +45 (11 base +9 con +5 Epic +5 Resistance +15 Cha)</p><p>REF: +45 (10 base +10 dex +5 Epic +5 Resistance +15 Cha)</p><p>WILL: +53 (21 base +7 wis +5 Epic +5 Resistance +15 Cha)</p><p>Init: +10 (10 dex)</p><p></p><p>Bab: 16</p><p>Ranged Touch Attacks: +26</p><p></p><p>Skills(Total/Ranks):[273 Points, Max rank 33] </p><p>Knowledges: Arcana(+42/33), History(+42/33), Royalty(+20/11)</p><p>Bluff(+20/5), Concentration (+10/1), Diplomacy(+48/33), Intimidate(+20/5), Listen(+20/13), Spot(+45/33), Spellcraft(+40/28), Perform[Dance](+16/1), Perform[String](+50/33), Perform[Sing](+16/1), Profession[Astrologer](+13/6), Sense Motive(+12/5), Sleight of Hand(+18/8), Tumble(+42/12)</p><p>Skill Tricks: Point it out, Listen to this, Collector of Stories, Back on your feet, Acrobatic Backstab, Nimble Stand, Conceal Spellcasting, False Theurgy (12 pts)</p><p>*No synergy bonuses yet*</p><p></p><p>Feats: [13] Skill Focus(Spellcraft), Spell Focus(Transmutation, Evocation), Melodic Casting, Extra Music, Maximize Spell, Rapid Metamagic, Empower Spell, Heighten Spell, Persistant Spell, Quicken Spell, Twin Spell, Extend Spell</p><p></p><p>Epic Feats: [4] Intensify Spell, Improved Spell Capacity(Sublime), Improved Metamagic, Epic Heighten</p><p></p><p>Bonus Feats/Class Features: </p><p>Bardic Music(12/day), Bardic Knowledge(+21), Inspire Courage +1, Competence, Fascinate, Countersong, Captivating Melody, Bonus Spells(1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th), Spell Secret(1st & 2nd lvl Wu Jen spell known), Sonic Might(+1d6/spell lvl), Sublime Casting(Add to WuJen CL) Arcane Spellpower+4, Expanded Spell Knowledge(From Wujen to Bard: 1st,2nd,3rd; From Wujen to Sublime: 4th,5th), Augmented Casting(5th or lower, 8/day), Telepathy, Spontaneous Trickster, Metamagic Trick, Tricky Magic</p><p>High Arcana: Arcane reach(7th), Mastery of Elements(8th)</p><p></p><p>Languages: Common, Draconic, Sylvan, Celestial, Giant</p><p></p><p></p><p>Equipment: 4,300,000</p><p>Read Books: Dex+5, Cha+5,Con+5, Int+4, Wis+5(660,000)</p><p>Armour of the Celestial Battalion (616,300)</p><p>+5 Mithril Buckler of Heavy Fortification (101,015)</p><p>Cloak of Charisma+6/Resistance+5 (73,500)</p><p>Boots of Swiftness(256,000)</p><p>Circlet of Awareness[Int+6, Wis+6] (90,000)</p><p>Amulet of Supreme Health[Con+6, Immune to Disease/Poison, Wound Closure, Adaptation] (123,750)</p><p>Ring of Magic [Arcane Might, Spell Battle] (97,600)</p><p>Ring of Defense [Universal Energy Resistance, Sustenance, Freedom of Movement] (279,750)</p><p>Horizon Goggles of the Eagle(+5 spot) (11,750)</p><p>MW Lyre of Building(13,100)</p><p>Strings of Spell Storing (45,000)</p><p>Spool of Endless Rope (2,000)</p><p>Caster GloveX2 (40,000)</p><p>Portable Hole (20,000)</p><p>Hewards Handy Haversack (2,000)</p><p></p><p>Immovable Metamagic Lordly Rod "OF" [Immovable, Lordly Might + Lesser, Normal, and Greater of each: Chain, Empower, Maximize, Quicken, Enlarge, Extend, Silent](1,608,300) (+ 236,000) Intelligent)</p><p>Intelligent Item: Immovable Metamagic Lordly Rod "OF" : </p><p>Int 10, Wis 19, Cha 19, AL: CN, Speech, Telepathy, 120' Darkvision, Blindsense, Hearing</p><p>Dedicated Purpose: Slay Dragons. Dedicated Power: Waves of Exhaustion. </p><p>Primary Powers: Dimensional Anchor 1/day, Status at will, Haste 3/day</p><p>Lesser Powers: Intimidate(+16), Bluff(+14), Diplomacy(+18), Sense Motive(+14)</p><p>Ego: 27</p><p>Remaining: 23,935</p><p>[/sblock]</p><p>[sblock=Math Breakdowns]</p><p>Human Bard2/Paladin2/Wu Jen3/Ultimate Magus10/Sublime Chord1/Mindbender1/E.Knight1/Lyric Thaumaturge 5/Magical Trickster3/Archmage2</p><p>*First 20 lvls = Bard2/Paladin2/WuJen3/Magus6/Sublime1/Mindbender1/Knight1/Lyric4</p><p>*lvl order= Bard2/Paladin2/WuJen3/Magus3/Sublime1/Magus3/Mindbender1/Knight1/Lyric5/Magus4/Arch2/Trickster3</p><p></p><p>HD: Bard2d6+Paladin2d10+WuJen3d4+Magus10d4+Sublime1d6+Bender1d4+Knight1d10+Lyric5d6+Trickster3d6+Arch2d4</p><p></p><p></p><p>BAB: </p><p>Bard 1, Pal 2, Wu Jen 1, Magus 3, Lyric 3, Knight 1, + 5 Epic = 16</p><p></p><p>Saves: </p><p>Fort: Bard+0 Paladin+3 Wujen+1 Magus+2 Sublime+0 Mindbender+2 Knight+2 Lyric+1=11</p><p>Ref: Bard+3 Paladin+0 Wujen+1 Magus+2 Sublime+0 Mindbender+0 Knight+0 Lyric+4=10</p><p>Will: Bard+3 Paladin+0 Wujen+3 Magus+5 Sublime+2 Mindbender+2 Knight+2 Lyric+4=21</p><p></p><p>Skills: </p><p>Bard 6x2, Pal 2x2, Wu Jen 2x3, Lyric 4x5, Knight 2, Sublime 4, Bender 2, Archmage 2x2, Trickster 4x3, Magus10x2 Human&Int= 5x33 +2 Amplified Int @lvl20 = 11X2 = 273 Skill points </p><p></p><p>CL Math: </p><p>Bard2/Wujen3</p><p>Bard3/Wujen3(Magus1*Bard*)</p><p>Bard4/Wujen4(Magus2)</p><p>Bard5/Wujen5(Magus3)</p><p>Bard5/Sublime1/Wujen5(Sublime1)</p><p>Bard5/Sublime2/Wujen5(Magus4*Sublime*)</p><p>Bard5/Sublime3/Wujen6(Magus5)</p><p>Bard5/Sublime4/Wujen7(Magus6)</p><p>Bard5/Sublime4/Wujen8(Bender1*Wujen*)</p><p>Bard5/Sublime4/Wujen9(Lyric1*Wujen*)</p><p>Bard5/Sublime4/Wujen10(Lyric2*Wujen*)</p><p>Bard5/Sublime4/Wujen11(Lyric3*Wujen*)</p><p>Bard5/Sublime4/Wujen12(Lyric4*Wujen*)</p><p>Bard5/Sublime4/Wujen13(Lyric5*Wujen*)</p><p>Bard5/Sublime5/Wujen13(Magus7*Sublime*)</p><p>Bard5/Sublime6/Wujen14(Magus8)</p><p>Bard5/Sublime7/Wujen15(Magus9)</p><p>Bard5/Sublime8/Wujen16(Magus10)</p><p>Bard5/Sublime10/Wujen16(Trickster3*Sublime*)</p><p>Bard5/Sublime10/Wujen18(Archmage2*Wujen*)</p><p>CL: Bard 10, Sublime 33, Wujen 33</p><p></p><p>[/sblock]</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Jemal, post: 5545452, member: 9026"] Vertex - I believe the thing you're refering to is if a skill is on a creatures skill list it's a racial skill for them. Don't recall racial bonuses giving class skills (Otherwise all elves would have Spot/listen, all halflings would have Hide/move silent/listen, All Half-elves would have diplomacy, etc..) If you want to simplify things, (and your base rase is human) I'd suggest the Able Learner feat, it makes all skills cost 1 skill point regardless of cc or not.. Which means all you have to figure out at Epic is if a skill was a class skill for ANY of your classes. If so, its 1/rank and max as a class skill=HD+3. If not, it's 1/rank and max as a cc skill=(HD+3)/2. And in regards to the Geomancer, I've done some work on my sublime chord, and allthough he's infinitely more complicated, he's also a LOT more fun, and I've allready got lots of backstory for him and his rod.. er, perhaps I should rephrase that.. You see, he has a magical stick that.. wait, wait.. I gave him an Intelligent Item, which is also an epic 1.6Million(Not counting intelligent cost) multi-purpose Rod. I knew I had to use the sublime chord over the wearbear when I realized I'd had more fun making the Rod, it's purpose, its personality, and their combined backstory than I did making the bear. Heck, I even added in Rod of Lordly might and Immovable Rod to its powers simply b/c they fit with it's Stubborn/Regal Personality! I love it when stuff like that happens :D Anyways, here's the dirty I've got so far. It was originally copied from a lvl 20 sorc, so there may be some things I missed in the changing. And I've yet to finish his spell selection, so it's not included (He casts as a lvl 6 bard, Full Sublime Chord, Full Wu Jen). Gotta head to work but will post up backstory next time. [sblock=The Messenger] Human Bard2/Paladin2/Wu Jen3/Ultimate Magus 10/Mindbender1/Lyric Thaumaturge 5/E.Knight1/Sublime Chord 1/Magical Trickster3/Archmage2 *First 20 lvls = Bard2/Paladin2/WuJen3/Magus6/Sublime1/Mindbender1/Knight1/Lyric4 AL: CG HT: 5'11" WT: 150 Hair: Red with Silver Highlights Eyes: Sea-green {91 Points *+1 for guessing near-correct on hundred headed hydra*} STR: 10 (+0) [10 Points] DEX: 30 (+10) [15 Points +5 Inherent +6 Enhancement +4 Sacred] CON: 28 (+9) [17 Points +5 Inherent +6 Enhancement] INT: 28 (+9) [18 Points +4 Inherent +6 Enhancement] WIS: 24 (+7) [13 Points +5 Inherent +6 Enhancement] CHA: 40 (+15) [18 Points + 7 level +5 Inherent +6 Enhancement +4 Sacred] HP: (3d10+11d6+16d4+270) AC: 58 (10 base +10 dex +12 Armour +6 Shield +5 Nat.Armour + 15 Deflection) Saves: FORT: +45 (11 base +9 con +5 Epic +5 Resistance +15 Cha) REF: +45 (10 base +10 dex +5 Epic +5 Resistance +15 Cha) WILL: +53 (21 base +7 wis +5 Epic +5 Resistance +15 Cha) Init: +10 (10 dex) Bab: 16 Ranged Touch Attacks: +26 Skills(Total/Ranks):[273 Points, Max rank 33] Knowledges: Arcana(+42/33), History(+42/33), Royalty(+20/11) Bluff(+20/5), Concentration (+10/1), Diplomacy(+48/33), Intimidate(+20/5), Listen(+20/13), Spot(+45/33), Spellcraft(+40/28), Perform[Dance](+16/1), Perform[String](+50/33), Perform[Sing](+16/1), Profession[Astrologer](+13/6), Sense Motive(+12/5), Sleight of Hand(+18/8), Tumble(+42/12) Skill Tricks: Point it out, Listen to this, Collector of Stories, Back on your feet, Acrobatic Backstab, Nimble Stand, Conceal Spellcasting, False Theurgy (12 pts) *No synergy bonuses yet* Feats: [13] Skill Focus(Spellcraft), Spell Focus(Transmutation, Evocation), Melodic Casting, Extra Music, Maximize Spell, Rapid Metamagic, Empower Spell, Heighten Spell, Persistant Spell, Quicken Spell, Twin Spell, Extend Spell Epic Feats: [4] Intensify Spell, Improved Spell Capacity(Sublime), Improved Metamagic, Epic Heighten Bonus Feats/Class Features: Bardic Music(12/day), Bardic Knowledge(+21), Inspire Courage +1, Competence, Fascinate, Countersong, Captivating Melody, Bonus Spells(1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th), Spell Secret(1st & 2nd lvl Wu Jen spell known), Sonic Might(+1d6/spell lvl), Sublime Casting(Add to WuJen CL) Arcane Spellpower+4, Expanded Spell Knowledge(From Wujen to Bard: 1st,2nd,3rd; From Wujen to Sublime: 4th,5th), Augmented Casting(5th or lower, 8/day), Telepathy, Spontaneous Trickster, Metamagic Trick, Tricky Magic High Arcana: Arcane reach(7th), Mastery of Elements(8th) Languages: Common, Draconic, Sylvan, Celestial, Giant Equipment: 4,300,000 Read Books: Dex+5, Cha+5,Con+5, Int+4, Wis+5(660,000) Armour of the Celestial Battalion (616,300) +5 Mithril Buckler of Heavy Fortification (101,015) Cloak of Charisma+6/Resistance+5 (73,500) Boots of Swiftness(256,000) Circlet of Awareness[Int+6, Wis+6] (90,000) Amulet of Supreme Health[Con+6, Immune to Disease/Poison, Wound Closure, Adaptation] (123,750) Ring of Magic [Arcane Might, Spell Battle] (97,600) Ring of Defense [Universal Energy Resistance, Sustenance, Freedom of Movement] (279,750) Horizon Goggles of the Eagle(+5 spot) (11,750) MW Lyre of Building(13,100) Strings of Spell Storing (45,000) Spool of Endless Rope (2,000) Caster GloveX2 (40,000) Portable Hole (20,000) Hewards Handy Haversack (2,000) Immovable Metamagic Lordly Rod "OF" [Immovable, Lordly Might + Lesser, Normal, and Greater of each: Chain, Empower, Maximize, Quicken, Enlarge, Extend, Silent](1,608,300) (+ 236,000) Intelligent) Intelligent Item: Immovable Metamagic Lordly Rod "OF" : Int 10, Wis 19, Cha 19, AL: CN, Speech, Telepathy, 120' Darkvision, Blindsense, Hearing Dedicated Purpose: Slay Dragons. Dedicated Power: Waves of Exhaustion. Primary Powers: Dimensional Anchor 1/day, Status at will, Haste 3/day Lesser Powers: Intimidate(+16), Bluff(+14), Diplomacy(+18), Sense Motive(+14) Ego: 27 Remaining: 23,935 [/sblock] [sblock=Math Breakdowns] Human Bard2/Paladin2/Wu Jen3/Ultimate Magus10/Sublime Chord1/Mindbender1/E.Knight1/Lyric Thaumaturge 5/Magical Trickster3/Archmage2 *First 20 lvls = Bard2/Paladin2/WuJen3/Magus6/Sublime1/Mindbender1/Knight1/Lyric4 *lvl order= Bard2/Paladin2/WuJen3/Magus3/Sublime1/Magus3/Mindbender1/Knight1/Lyric5/Magus4/Arch2/Trickster3 HD: Bard2d6+Paladin2d10+WuJen3d4+Magus10d4+Sublime1d6+Bender1d4+Knight1d10+Lyric5d6+Trickster3d6+Arch2d4 BAB: Bard 1, Pal 2, Wu Jen 1, Magus 3, Lyric 3, Knight 1, + 5 Epic = 16 Saves: Fort: Bard+0 Paladin+3 Wujen+1 Magus+2 Sublime+0 Mindbender+2 Knight+2 Lyric+1=11 Ref: Bard+3 Paladin+0 Wujen+1 Magus+2 Sublime+0 Mindbender+0 Knight+0 Lyric+4=10 Will: Bard+3 Paladin+0 Wujen+3 Magus+5 Sublime+2 Mindbender+2 Knight+2 Lyric+4=21 Skills: Bard 6x2, Pal 2x2, Wu Jen 2x3, Lyric 4x5, Knight 2, Sublime 4, Bender 2, Archmage 2x2, Trickster 4x3, Magus10x2 Human&Int= 5x33 +2 Amplified Int @lvl20 = 11X2 = 273 Skill points CL Math: Bard2/Wujen3 Bard3/Wujen3(Magus1*Bard*) Bard4/Wujen4(Magus2) Bard5/Wujen5(Magus3) Bard5/Sublime1/Wujen5(Sublime1) Bard5/Sublime2/Wujen5(Magus4*Sublime*) Bard5/Sublime3/Wujen6(Magus5) Bard5/Sublime4/Wujen7(Magus6) Bard5/Sublime4/Wujen8(Bender1*Wujen*) Bard5/Sublime4/Wujen9(Lyric1*Wujen*) Bard5/Sublime4/Wujen10(Lyric2*Wujen*) Bard5/Sublime4/Wujen11(Lyric3*Wujen*) Bard5/Sublime4/Wujen12(Lyric4*Wujen*) Bard5/Sublime4/Wujen13(Lyric5*Wujen*) Bard5/Sublime5/Wujen13(Magus7*Sublime*) Bard5/Sublime6/Wujen14(Magus8) Bard5/Sublime7/Wujen15(Magus9) Bard5/Sublime8/Wujen16(Magus10) Bard5/Sublime10/Wujen16(Trickster3*Sublime*) Bard5/Sublime10/Wujen18(Archmage2*Wujen*) CL: Bard 10, Sublime 33, Wujen 33 [/sblock] [/QUOTE]
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