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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Bryan898" data-source="post: 1919942" data-attributes="member: 9085">I've had a few games that went into epic levels.  I found that I enjoyed starting at lower levels and working your way into epic levels much more.  When I started the PCs at 21st level they often bit the big one rather quickly.  Also, unless you have very well developed PC's or very good roleplayers, it will be hard to affect them by threatening their relations.  Though I love epic feel, I have a few beefs with the ELH.  First off, I don't like the level range of the book. I would have preferred if it were written for another 10 to 20 levels.  There are some really cool feats, classes, magic items, and monsters that I will never use (or the PCs for that matter) because I wouldn't run a game that long.  I also hated the magic system, and I simply went with increasing their possible spell levels instead.  That way they can use metamagic for 12th level spells, or create spells of suitable power for the given level.  One thing I did find that balanced spellcasters was still allowing 3.0 haste effects, or creating a higher level spell that emulated the spell.  The additional spell provides them with a much needed boost at higher levels.  Another thing I did was allow them to create many metamagic rods that worked from levels 1-9.  I'm going to go off on a small rant here, so excuse me if it's off topic, but I don't see the point to epic levels.  It's all about scale, and all this book does is increase the scale.  Why not have most commoners and humanoids in the world be lower levels?  You could create the same epic feel if the truly "epic" levels are the 15-20 range.  Demigods are usually about 25th level, a lot of the monsters in the ELH are scaled down to 20-25 CR (which works well considering the lack of high level monsters), and the planes are a powerful place full of nasty creatures such as Balor's and Pit Fiends.  The Tarrasque and Demon Lords are still all powerful creatures that are nigh unstoppable.  You could change the feats to having high requirements so they're attainable only by the high levels, which would fill the void for powerful feats at higher levels.  Artifacts would remain just that, a +10 weapon would still be powerful, and you could still save the world every day.  I simply don't see the need for the large math which tends to slow down combat... At level 40 you may do 300 damage a round, but the monster has 3,000 hp.  It's the exact same as doing 30 damage a round against a 300 hp creature at 10th level.  The only true need I see for epic level is when your characters hit that 20th level, but the stories not finished.  Even in such a case I still wouldn't go beyond 30th level.  Heck, by 28th level my characters were in the middle of a four way battle between Mephistopheles, Asmodeus, a Solar, and the Demogorgon (BoVD).  They still held their own, and though the battle ended in a TPK as they tried to escape, they still took down the main objective and saved the day.  I personally wouldn't want a character that could down a demigod in one round, "but that's just my opinion, I could be wrong"  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin    :D"  data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" /></blockquote>

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