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<blockquote data-quote="Jack Simth" data-source="post: 3035480" data-attributes="member: 29252">I'm honestly not entirely certain.Perhaps the ELH &quot;Primary Seed&quot; rule is appropriet; but then, people will be making Conjour Seed as the primary, and tacking on the Energy seed so what's conjoured is lit napalm in the target's square, and claiming energy's SR: Yes and Save: Reflex Half doesn't apply (silly Orb spells and precident).Perhaps we could say that only things that directly affect something that isn't part of the spell permit SR - but again, people will be making Conjour Seed spells where the energy seed is &quot;merely&quot; used to set off the &quot;mundane napalm&quot; (silly Orb spells and precident).As difficult as it would be for the DM with annoyed players, I suppose the best way to keep it reasonably balanced would be to make it explicitly DM call, with a handful of basic examples/guidelines - using Heal to grant Fast Healing to a Summoned Creature doesn't give the spell SR or a save, as it's the summoned creature (the spell effect) being affected, not the thing the creature hits.&nbsp; However, using the energy seed to grant a summoned creature a breath weapon permits SR for the breath weapon (and thus, the spell becomes SR: See Text and Save: See Text) as the energy seed is being used to affect the target the summon uses it's spell-granted breath weapon on (blech, stupid preposition at a sentence end!).&nbsp; Or something.&nbsp; I'm as I said, I'm not really sure.&nbsp; I find it a might easier to point out things that are trivially bizzare than it is to actually FIX them.Edit: Blech, Ay jest kan't spel tody, kan ay?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Jack Simth, post: 3035480, member: 29252"] I'm honestly not entirely certain. Perhaps the ELH "Primary Seed" rule is appropriet; but then, people will be making Conjour Seed as the primary, and tacking on the Energy seed so what's conjoured is lit napalm in the target's square, and claiming energy's SR: Yes and Save: Reflex Half doesn't apply (silly Orb spells and precident). Perhaps we could say that only things that directly affect something that isn't part of the spell permit SR - but again, people will be making Conjour Seed spells where the energy seed is "merely" used to set off the "mundane napalm" (silly Orb spells and precident). As difficult as it would be for the DM with annoyed players, I suppose the best way to keep it reasonably balanced would be to make it explicitly DM call, with a handful of basic examples/guidelines - using Heal to grant Fast Healing to a Summoned Creature doesn't give the spell SR or a save, as it's the summoned creature (the spell effect) being affected, not the thing the creature hits. However, using the energy seed to grant a summoned creature a breath weapon permits SR [i]for the breath weapon[/i] (and thus, the spell becomes SR: See Text and Save: See Text) as the energy seed is being used to affect the target the summon uses it's spell-granted breath weapon on (blech, stupid preposition at a sentence end!). Or something. I'm as I said, I'm not really sure. I find it a might easier to point out things that are trivially bizzare than it is to actually FIX them. Edit: Blech, Ay jest kan't spel tody, kan ay? [/QUOTE]

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