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<blockquote data-quote="heretic888" data-source="post: 5279998" data-attributes="member: 60326">Hi Greg,There are three points I would add here.1) All of what you described could be seen as at-will attack powers. I'm sure you have also seen particularly difficult or complicated maneuvers that any given &quot;fighter&quot; (I'm assuming you're talking about mixed martial artists here or something similar) has a chance of pulling off only about once every &quot;encounter&quot; (or fight). In fact, I have an extensive background in the martial arts and self-defense crisis management procedures and I know that there are direct analogues to &quot;encounter powers&quot; in real-life.Daily powers are a bit tougher to nail down, but I would like to fantasy literature and fiction for inspiration here, since this is what 4E is trying to replicate. 2) Not every action the characters take has a direct analogue to a dice roll. Presumably, the Fighter could have been attempting his awesome Spinning Sweep maneuver for the entire encounter, weaving in between his regular attacks, but only when the player activates his encounter power with a dice roll does the character have a decent chance of succeeding.Incidentally, a LOT of Fighter encounter and daily powers have the reliable keyword. I think that represents just what you describe above.3) A lot of people really, really need to read Martial Power 2. Just because a big strong guy swings a weapon does not mean he is using the martial power source. The martial power source is the province of larger-than-life heroes and villians. If you'll notice, virtually no monsters have the &quot;martial&quot; keyword in their attack powers.I think the problem with a lot of people not &quot;grokking&quot; martial powers has more to do with how they are explained or described to them, rather than the nature of the powers themselves...... for that matter, I don't buy this &quot;its magic&quot; argument for explaining arcane and divine powers, either. &quot;Its magic&quot; explains why the Cleric is calling lightning bolts or the Wizard is hurling fireballs. It does not adequately explain why they can only do this stuff once every five minutes or every 24 hours (the latter especially does not fly with most popular fantasy fiction that isn't D&amp;D-derived)......</blockquote>

[QUOTE="heretic888, post: 5279998, member: 60326"] Hi Greg, There are three points I would add here. 1) All of what you described could be seen as at-will attack powers. I'm sure you have also seen particularly difficult or complicated maneuvers that any given "fighter" (I'm assuming you're talking about mixed martial artists here or something similar) has a chance of pulling off only about once every "encounter" (or fight). In fact, I have an extensive background in the martial arts and self-defense crisis management procedures and I [i]know[/i] that there are direct analogues to "encounter powers" in real-life. Daily powers are a bit tougher to nail down, but I would like to fantasy literature and fiction for inspiration here, since this is what 4E is trying to replicate. 2) Not every action the characters take has a direct analogue to a dice roll. Presumably, the Fighter could have been attempting his awesome Spinning Sweep maneuver for the entire encounter, weaving in between his regular attacks, but only when the player activates his encounter power with a dice roll does the character have a decent chance of succeeding. Incidentally, a LOT of Fighter encounter and daily powers have the reliable keyword. I think that represents just what you describe above. 3) A lot of people really, really need to read Martial Power 2. Just because a big strong guy swings a weapon does [i]not[/i] mean he is using the martial power source. The martial power source is the province of larger-than-life heroes and villians. If you'll notice, virtually no monsters have the "martial" keyword in their attack powers. I think the problem with a lot of people not "grokking" martial powers has more to do with how they are explained or described to them, rather than the nature of the powers themselves. ..... for that matter, I don't buy this "its magic" argument for explaining arcane and divine powers, either. "Its magic" explains why the Cleric is calling lightning bolts or the Wizard is hurling fireballs. It does [i]not[/i] adequately explain why they can only do this stuff once every five minutes or every 24 hours (the latter especially does not fly with most popular fantasy fiction that isn't D&D-derived)...... [/QUOTE]

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