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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ilbranteloth" data-source="post: 7753925" data-attributes="member: 6778044">Again, this is where I disagree with [MENTION=22779]Hussar[/MENTION] and you.ere are a couple of definitions of cheating:Act dishonestly or unfairly in order to gain an advantage, especially in a game or examination. "she always cheats at cards"And another:Act dishonestly, be cunning, be dishonest, befool, beguile, betray, break faith, commit breach of trust, cozen, deceive, defalcate, defraud, deprive of dishonestly, dissemble, dupe, embezzle, fraudare, ignore ethics, lack honesty, obtain money by false pretenses, pettifog, play false, practice chicanery, practice fraud, prevaricate, purloin, represent falsely, sharp, swindle.The definition of cheating is all about being dishonest, unethical, breaking the rules, etc. Literally, by definition, playing by the rules cannot be cheating. Telling us we're cheating when we're following the rules, openly and honestly at our tables is insulting.The problem I have with folks continuing to call this cheating within the context of a game where it is explicitly allowed by the people playing the game. It's really not about what's in the rules, but what the people sitting at the table agree to. You're calling people dishonest. You're telling them they are wrong, and they shouldn't play the game that way. But they might find that they don't like the style that is more mechanically focused, and might decide that D&D or RPGs aren't for them. You're not wrong for wanting to play in a game where DMs aren't allowed to fudge or alter the rules. But we're not wrong for enjoying playing in one either. The book allows point buy. We don't use point buy at my table. The book allows fudging, and you don't allow that at your table. Fair enough. But there are a lot of people who still prefer to allow the DM a lot more leeway in adjudication of the game, including altering die rolls when they feel necessary. If those at the table all agree, then it is not cheating. They are not dishonest. They are not unethical. They are not playing in bad faith, and they are not breaking the rules. They just enjoy a different playstyle than you. Your example about jaywalking is irrelevant. Because the law (rules) don't say you can jaywalk. This isn't a question of ignoring something that somebody is doing wrong. It's about setting a specific rule (even if it's a house rule) that says it is allowed. That is, it is legal. If they change the law to read "you can cross the street anywhere you damn well please" then there is literally no such thing as jaywalking anymore. Because jaywalking is, literally, crossing the street illegally. If the paragraph in 5e wasn't there to allow DMs to fudge, then they could have simply written, "don't fudge the dice." They didn't need to put anything at all in the rules regarding it, and Gary Gygax certainly didn't need to in AD&D. Although in his case it wasn't, " lets you fudge the dice if you want to," it was "You do have every right to overrule the dice at any time" and there is literally no reason to add that line of text to any game unless it's something that you're allowed to do in the game. That's not ambiguous or mincing words. Have you ever seen any other game other than an RPG explicitly tell you that you can overrule the dice? There is absolutely no need to do that unless it's something that you can do. If you want to, and if the table agrees.</blockquote>

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