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<blockquote data-quote="BryonD" data-source="post: 5371731" data-attributes="member: 957">I think you are very significantly misinterpreting the data, and the fact that these debates continue is evidence of that.Yes, 3E had run it's course.&nbsp; I was ready and eager for a new game.&nbsp; But it was not at all the 3E system that had burned me out.&nbsp; If WotC had built a completely new system that still engaged me to the level 3E did I would be there.&nbsp; But the fact remains that it was an old game by that time.Now certainly 4E has brought in a significant number of people who were not 3E players.&nbsp; But, you are specifically talking about &quot;fired&quot; 3E players, so lets just look at that group for a moment.In my personal experience, if we took names of people who were playing 3E before 4E came along and listed them under either &quot;switched to 4E&quot; or &quot;didn't switch to 4E&quot;, the &quot;didn't list would be longer.&nbsp; That isn't a claim that all the &quot;didn't&quot; people are still playing 3E, many just went on to something else.&nbsp; The circumstantial and anecdotal evidence we keep seeing are universally consistent with my experience.&nbsp; So there certainly may be a distinct fog around the hard numbers, but my experience is in the right ballpark.&nbsp; So, was this the result of burned out experienced DMs?Well, lets go back to that list again, but this time only list &quot;experienced DMs&quot;.&nbsp; &quot;Switched to 4E&quot; gets trounced by this analysis.&nbsp; &nbsp; Admittedly, this doesn't disprove the potential that every one of those DMs were on the verge of burnout and would have walked away within a year.&nbsp; But even against this hypothetical, getting a bunch of experienced DMs to leave faster is no accomplishment.&nbsp;&nbsp; It is certainly encouraging that market perception has reached the point that we are debating the cause of so many people leaving D&amp;D.&nbsp; But 3E pushing away experienced DMs doesn't hold up as the reason.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="BryonD, post: 5371731, member: 957"] I think you are very significantly misinterpreting the data, and the fact that these debates continue is evidence of that. Yes, 3E had run it's course. I was ready and eager for a new game. But it was not at all the 3E system that had burned me out. If WotC had built a completely new system that still engaged me to the level 3E did I would be there. But the fact remains that it was an old game by that time. Now certainly 4E has brought in a significant number of people who were not 3E players. But, you are specifically talking about "fired" 3E players, so lets just look at that group for a moment. In my personal experience, if we took names of people who were playing 3E before 4E came along and listed them under either "switched to 4E" or "didn't switch to 4E", the "didn't list would be longer. That isn't a claim that all the "didn't" people are still playing 3E, many just went on to something else. The circumstantial and anecdotal evidence we keep seeing are universally consistent with my experience. So there certainly may be a distinct fog around the hard numbers, but my experience is in the right ballpark. So, was this the result of burned out experienced DMs? Well, lets go back to that list again, but this time only list "experienced DMs". "Switched to 4E" gets trounced by this analysis. Admittedly, this doesn't disprove the potential that every one of those DMs were on the verge of burnout and would have walked away within a year. But even against this hypothetical, getting a bunch of experienced DMs to leave faster is no accomplishment. It is certainly encouraging that market perception has reached the point that we are debating the cause of so many people leaving D&D. But 3E pushing away experienced DMs doesn't hold up as the reason. [/QUOTE]

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