Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Excerpt: Multiclassing (merged)
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="small pumpkin man" data-source="post: 4197321" data-attributes="member: 57910"><p>EXACTLY.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Which is simulated far better in 4e by just taking skill training theivery. (or in 3.x by taking that feat from races of destiny, although even that becomes less useful later on)</p><p></p><p>Yeah, that's exactly what I said. I said "I want to be able to do everything and be a complete munchkin", in fact, here's the quote</p><p></p><p>*sigh*</p><p></p><p>Look, I realize CR isn't exact, but when one 6th level Rogue and one 6th level Wizard is worth one level 8 Wizard I think we can safely say someone playing a character who has 6th level Rogue abilities and 6th level Wizard abilities isn't actually able to effect the world like a 12th level character is.</p><p> </p><p></p><p></p><p>No, he can't use it to make a reasonable difference to appropriate level encounters, meaning he might as well not be able to do it all.</p><p></p><p>Yes, duh, obviously a tradeoff needs to be made, this is <em>basic</em> designer stuff. But finding that balance is not as obvious as you seem to think, as far as I can tell, it's one of the toughest problems in game design, there are extensive articles about this on Wizard's very site, about the Bard etc, and about how they put far too much importance on the "generalist" aspect for Bards and monks, and far too little in the case of the pure spellcasters various abilities, even Hong has made about 6-7 posts in this very thread saying "we don't need to get into that argument again" but there's always someone, sin't there?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="small pumpkin man, post: 4197321, member: 57910"] EXACTLY. Which is simulated far better in 4e by just taking skill training theivery. (or in 3.x by taking that feat from races of destiny, although even that becomes less useful later on) Yeah, that's exactly what I said. I said "I want to be able to do everything and be a complete munchkin", in fact, here's the quote *sigh* Look, I realize CR isn't exact, but when one 6th level Rogue and one 6th level Wizard is worth one level 8 Wizard I think we can safely say someone playing a character who has 6th level Rogue abilities and 6th level Wizard abilities isn't actually able to effect the world like a 12th level character is. No, he can't use it to make a reasonable difference to appropriate level encounters, meaning he might as well not be able to do it all. Yes, duh, obviously a tradeoff needs to be made, this is [i]basic[/i] designer stuff. But finding that balance is not as obvious as you seem to think, as far as I can tell, it's one of the toughest problems in game design, there are extensive articles about this on Wizard's very site, about the Bard etc, and about how they put far too much importance on the "generalist" aspect for Bards and monks, and far too little in the case of the pure spellcasters various abilities, even Hong has made about 6-7 posts in this very thread saying "we don't need to get into that argument again" but there's always someone, sin't there? [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Excerpt: Multiclassing (merged)
Top