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Message: <blockquote data-quote="jelmore" data-source="post: 4204559" data-attributes="member: 56412">I agree totally. Where is it written that Intimidate must always have a chance of succeeding? Or Bluff, or Diplomacy, for that matter?Scenario: The PCs attempt to Bluff their way past the guards at the front door of the Baron's estate to see the Baron. However, these guys aren't the stereotypical bored or corrupt or incompetent guards; these are the Silver Wyverns, the personal protection retinue for the Baron, and they have been given explicit orders to not allow anyone into the Baron's residence if they are not in the company of the Baron himself, or on a very short list of well-known people -- the Baron's wife, his master-at-arms, and the court wizard -- as the Baron has recently been the target of an assassination attempt. (The nature of the Silver Wyverns, and word of the assassination attempt, would be information that is available to the PCs with the correct Knowledge or Gather Information checks.)Why must I, as the hypothetical DM, allow for the possibility that any Bluff result would allow for the PCs to bluster their way past the guards? They're not going to let you "deliver a package" and they're not going to accept that you are a "last-minute security inspection" (since that's their job). The guard's orders are clear: If you're not with the Baron and not one of three people that they are all familiar with, you are not getting in. The same goes for Intimidate; the Silver Wyverns take pride in their job, and they're expected to risk their lives if it means protecting their charge, so threatening to break their kneecaps or consign their souls to the Nine Hells aren't going to persuade them to let you in.It's not "railroading", it's a challenge to be overcome by other means. The same goes for the example Duke in the example negotiation.</blockquote>

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