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Message: <blockquote data-quote="lukzu" data-source="post: 2790763" data-attributes="member: 34128">It warms my heart to see the boys at ENworld talking about elitism on rpg.net while looking down their noses at a non-d20 game. The world is truly a wonderful place.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> James, if you'll permit me, I'll take you last comment as a compliment: Thank you.To answer the OP's queries, let's do a compare and contrast. I'll offer up some of BW's mechanical underpinnings and system philosophy. You all feel free to offer up the same from another fantasy rpg of any era.And let me out myself right here, I disagree with James. System ("getting there") does matter, perhaps more than the results. Sure, in DnD and BW you might get to overthrow the city state and kill the tyrannical overlord. But in one you do it because the GM thinks it's ok and cool, and the other you do it because the system supports you in the resolution of each conflict and the fulfillment of your stated goals as player.Ok, in Burning Wheel, we reduce the whiff factor by using die pools and the Let it Ride mechanic. Let it Ride states that you roll once per conflict (excluding extended conflicts like fighting and arguing). You do not reroll at the GM's behest until you fail.In Burning Wheel, the player decides his own goals for his character, and his character's ethos. There are no restrictions or categories, only a limit that you must choose three Beliefs. These Beliefs then determine how the player is rewarded in play.Rewards do not equal advancement. Advancement is a separate track. Rewards are spent to modify die rolls so that when that one test comes up which you must pass, you can spent your reward points and do it.Extended conflict requires active player strategizing and participation. It's very hard to get by in BW by just shouting "I attack" and throwing a die. The Fight!, Range and Cover, and Duel of Wits mechanics encourage players to think about the situation in the game and to roleplay in a focused manner.Lastly, the game actively speaks out against GM fiat. In BW, the GM is just another player with some specific, albeit important, duties. So let's compare. Lots of other games have these features. Who's first? DnD? Runequest? Warhammer?-L</blockquote>

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