Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="Balesir" data-source="post: 6815669" data-attributes="member: 27160">Um, yes. I agree. If this is contrary, I wonder what point you thought I was trying to make? The AP approach and the sandbox approach differ, no question. In one the GM sets the dramatic need (by having the bad guys act first), whereas in the sandbox the GM presents a range - call it a smorgasbord or a menu - of dramatic needs that the players get to choose from among.Now, you could argue that the sandbox players can pick another dramatic need that is not on the table, but since that hasn't been prepared for it wouldn't then be pre-authored, would it?First off I will say that &quot;protagonist&quot; and &quot;antagonist&quot; (the quotes here aren't to twist them around - just call them out as labels) are roles in stories that, by their nature, are labels used from a point of view in non-fiction, but tend to be defined by the storyteller in fiction (such as RPGs). In an RPG the player characters are (ideally) the protagonists because they are the ones from whose viewpoint the story is being witnessed.The point of my origianl quotes was to describe how, in villain driven plots, the villain is the original protagonist - they &quot;talk first&quot;. The heroes are, from a strict (ancient greek) perspective, antagonists. Once play begins, though, the perspective leads the PCs become protagonists as they take up the dramatic need to &quot;stop the bad guy(s)&quot;.Secondly I'll say that, although offering a menu of options to players in this regard is definitely qualitatively different from the &quot;take it or leave it&quot; approach of the fixed scenario, I personally consider the divide between GM authored and player authored dramatic needs a more profound divide. As to which of the three methodologies is &quot;best&quot;, I don't think it's a meaningful question. Some of the best restaurants trim back their menu to a minimum of options or even a fixed succession of courses to ensure that everything is of the highest quality, but for some people no amount of a la carte choice can replace cooking something for yourself. These are different strokes...</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Balesir, post: 6815669, member: 27160"] Um, yes. I agree. If this is contrary, I wonder what point you thought I was trying to make? The AP approach and the sandbox approach differ, no question. In one the GM sets the dramatic need (by having the bad guys act first), whereas in the sandbox the GM presents a range - call it a smorgasbord or a menu - of dramatic needs that the players get to choose from among. Now, you could argue that the sandbox players can pick another dramatic need that is not on the table, but since that hasn't been prepared for it wouldn't then be pre-authored, would it? First off I will say that "protagonist" and "antagonist" (the quotes here aren't to twist them around - just call them out as labels) are roles in stories that, by their nature, are labels used from a point of view in non-fiction, but tend to be defined by the storyteller in fiction (such as RPGs). In an RPG the player characters are (ideally) the protagonists because they are the ones from whose viewpoint the story is being witnessed. The point of my origianl quotes was to describe how, in villain driven plots, the villain is the original protagonist - they "talk first". The heroes are, from a strict (ancient greek) perspective, antagonists. Once play begins, though, the perspective leads the PCs become protagonists as they take up the dramatic need to "stop the bad guy(s)". Secondly I'll say that, although offering a menu of options to players in this regard is definitely qualitatively different from the "take it or leave it" approach of the fixed scenario, I personally consider the divide between GM authored and player authored dramatic needs a more profound divide. As to which of the three methodologies is "best", I don't think it's a meaningful question. Some of the best restaurants trim back their menu to a minimum of options or even a fixed succession of courses to ensure that everything is of the highest quality, but for some people no amount of a la carte choice can replace cooking something for yourself. These are different strokes... [/QUOTE]

Verification