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Message: <blockquote data-quote="triqui" data-source="post: 5880381" data-attributes="member: 57948">No, but the Baron has alredy paid the equipment (and in all fairness, if they are militia, they probably came with their own weapons. That's why they are militia, not professional soldiers). In any case:EXACTLY. And that's the reason they can survive 12 crossbows as well. That's easy. Because of adventurers <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />. Which is the way the game is developed to have a plot reason, as you said 2 minutes ago.  That's a moot point. You could assing that baby troll whatever CR you want in D&D, yes. He could be a baby troll 25 level solo. Just like Smaug could be a lvl 4 minion and a LotR rat could be level 30 elite. That does not make any sense, however. If you judge a troll like the one in the book/film, by D&D standards, it's no more than CR 4-5. It does not have the size, or the strength, or the resiliance, of a Giant. It is not tougher than a D&D troll (it does not even regenerates). It's not invulnerable, have no magic, does not fly...  Just like Fizban did in Dragonlance. Because he is a NPC controlled by DM, a plot device who is there to give advice and some nice plot hooks. He is able to go toe to toe with Balrogs, go figure. The problem is level and abilities make the characters break the LotR inmersion. At 15 level, in D&D, a fighter can put his full plate, jump, and break the world record. That's not believable in LotR. There are two ways to avoid that:a) forbid the player to be 15th levelb) forbid the player to have the skills, abilities, powers and feats of a 15th level character.Both are actually the same, the second one just disguises it. It's like saying "you are 15th level, but you have skills max as a 6th level char. You can have spells, but you are limited to 6 caster levels. You have hit points, but not too much, aproximatedly like a 6th level character. But hey, I allow you to be 15th level. I am so much generous than E6, am I not? I think I do not make my point across. There's no way Aragorn could kill a dragon, being ancient or not. If a Portal is open between Middle Earth and GreyHawk, Aragorn travels to GreyHawk, he could not defeat a regular, normal adult dragon. If the Fellowship finds an ice trapped normal, adult dragon in a iceberg, Captain America  style, he couldn't defeat either. The martial prowess Tolkien gives him in his description is not just enough. A dragon, regular, normal, would eat several baby trolls for lunch. Aragorn can't. They aren't even in the same league. Drizzt Do Urden, however, can defeat dragons. Beowulf can, as  well. Or Sigfried. Sir Lancelot could defeat dragons. Achilles could, for sure. Or Cuchulain, or Bhima. Elric of Melnibone could defeat dragons too. Aragorn can't, for the same reasons Jon Snow can't either. It's not their league.  That's true. Feoner would be like 35+.Hoewever, there are other characters in LotR who aren't first age. Let's take a look to them. If, in your opinion, Aragorn is paragon (around 10th level in 3.5, or around 15th or so in 4e)... what level are then Elrohir and Elladan, Elrond's sons?. What level is Celeborn? What's the level of Glorfindel then? What's the level of Khamul the Dragon Lord? Or the Witch King? Or Elrond himself? It's simply impossible to fill them in the same scale, if Aragorn is 15th level.  Background is not adventure. Aragorn is a dunedain, a long lived character. He has being adventurign for 50 years. I once made a lvl 1 elf character who was 200 years old and had been adventuring for a century. That does not change the adventure itself, it's background, in D&D terms. The adventure starts when Frodo takes the ring from Bilbo.  Because his character isn't described badass enough to dodge arrows. However, let's assume he does. Isn't exactly that your problem? That you find unbelievable that characters survive 12 shots? Remember, hit points also represent dodges, etc. In that scene, Achilles character maybe has 350 hp and the Dm is describing him dodging the arrows, getting a bit of fatigue and nothing else.  I don't see the difference. The PC might have shields too.  for those, it's better to use a system that does not use levels. Or use levels, but in a different way, not a way that implies that when you are 20th, you kill ancient wyrms and balors. I agree with that. There are systems that get this kind of gritty systems (and actually I enjoy a few of them). In Legends of the Five Ring, for most characters, 1 hit is almost 1 ko. Nobody will laugh at 12 bows. Nobody.However, D&D isn't well suited for that. You could suit it, or a d20 variant, but the cost is getting Balors, Ancient Dragons and beholders out. You can't make a 12th level character who can survive a Beholder, but is scaried of 12 goblins with shortbows. It just does not float.</blockquote>

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