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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Raven Crowking" data-source="post: 5180813" data-attributes="member: 18280">See?  There are some things we can agree on.Now, extrapolate out again, and assume that the putative poster has also seen hundreds of other GMs attempt foo, with the same results.  Should not that GM conclude that, while it might be possible for a GM to make foo work, the odds are very good that the average GM will not be able to do so?For example, in this post (<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/5180342-post101.html" target="_blank">http://www.enworld.org/forum/5180342-post101.html</a>), the poster saysI just don't see how you could sit down to play a session without any story elements at all. To me, it's an ongoing process, constantly being redefined as play progresses. But, the idea that there is nothing at all before the players sit down at the table is very difficult for me to believe.It seems to me that this poster is doing exactly what I am advocating.He is not saying that it is impossible....he is saying that it is implausible (very difficult....to believe).  He might even go so far (although he does not in this post) as to accept that some specific counter-examples exist, but that he would assume that they were very rare indeed.It would strike me as odd if the poster I just quoted would suggest that other posters not extrapolate from their experiences as to what is, or is not, plausible.By all means.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin    :D"  data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" />You are only wrong because you used the word "cannot".If you said instead,I find claims of working sandbox games to be implausible.  I've never seen a successful sandbox game in play as either a DM or a player.  They ultimately become aimless, pointless, meaningless jumbles of conflicting goals and will always die, not with a bang, but with a whimper as players and DM lose interest.  There may be a sandbox game out there that defies the odds, but I am skeptical to most claims related to specific games.you would be golden.RC</blockquote>

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