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Message: <blockquote data-quote="NoOneofConsequence" data-source="post: 252188" data-attributes="member: 5400">Not that I'm an expert, but this thread is too juicy for me not to take a major bite.First of all, how powerful is this god you're 'fake' worshipping? If they can read minds, then your lip service may only serve to PO them even worse than if you didn't worship.One of the things which has been left out of this discussion, I feel, and out of roleplaying in general, is what does the god want from humanity (elves, dwarves, whatever). In essence, what is the deity's agenda?THis more than anything, I think, would influence the nature of the divine/mortal relationships going on. For example, what constitutes worship for a particular god? Getting down on your knees and praying may be enough for some deities, but I think the more bloodthirsty are going to demand a bit of sacrifice (you or someone else) before it even starts to qualify as worship.This is one of the things that gets lost in a lot of campaign settings, especially FR. Reams and reams of information are provided on what powers and spells clerics get, but very, very little on what clerics are expected to do in exchange. And never mind lay worshippers or initiated non-clergy.All of which leads me to my favourite bugbear (no, not the humanoid kind) - healing for hire. Clerics in D&D are, in too many cases, magic paramedics. Their main purpose is to provide healing to whomever pays (ok, I know that they get other spells & powers besides healing, but my statement still holds some water). Frankly, the vast majority of historical religions don't hold truck with this notion, I don't see why a religion with a demonstrably live and miraculous deity at its head would put up with it either. I mean, I keep seeing this scene in my head:CLERIC: Oh great god <insert name here>, I call upon your power to deliver this fallen warrior, Zob the Mighty back from...DEITY: I'm sorry, Zob who?CLERIC: Zob the Mighty...who languishes...DEITY: Never heard of him.CLERIC: Well, no...but he made some donations to the temple before you see and now he's dead and...DIETY: A few measly donations, why do you think I would bestow my miraculous power on him that? I have followers who are truly devoted to me, who honour me daily. What's makes this Zob so special?CLERIC: Well, his friends are donating ten thousand pieces of gold, which will make your temple grander and wealthier and...DEITY: and get you that Mace of Disruption you've had your eye on, hhmmm? DO not lie to me, for we are bound by the priestly oaths which you swore to me.CLERIC: but...but....DEITY: Not only will I NOT bestow this miracle upon Zob, but I shall take from you all the powers I have bestowed upon you for you impertinence, until you have atoned in a suitable manner (GM and not in the completely wussy cast a 3rd level spell way)...yada yada yada.OK, not every deity is going to react in this way, but I can't help feeling that a lot will. I think what settings need is not more deities, but more ways to relate to deities, in detail. Religious practices, ceremonies, sacrifices, ways to please deities and consequences of annoying them.Sorry but I think my rant hit an oil patch and slid out of control a little there.</blockquote>

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