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Message: <blockquote data-quote="painandgreed" data-source="post: 1879389" data-attributes="member: 24969">I agree. While there might be a case for special PCs or NPCs who were but became what they are through shear determination or effort may be the case, most probably came into their classes due to benefit of their family.With the old UA, people used to make fun of the Social Standing tables saying that 1% of the population wasn't noblity and royalty, to which I'd reply, "but 1% of adventurers are."Ya, I remembered that right before my last post. Forgot totally about stat increases. Still not used to 3.x rules. I also haven't gone into economic effects of magic items yet such as stat increasing items for craftsmen and professionals or magical artisan tools. it's in the back of my mind currently. Eventually it'll come out. Good points and I agree for the most part. First, anybody paying a band of adventurers what they'll want will damn sure use them. I doubt if they'll be sitting around but more likely out doing stuff. IMC, the life of a noble in all but the most stable lands is a constant military campaign with constant raids, fueds, wandering monsters, and minor skrimishes. If nothing else there's the time honored habit of fighting for somebody else as an excuse to raid, fued, and fight. the adventurers get a letter from the king saying that they act as his agents in attacking the other country and in return the king gets half of the money. The payback is that the PCs have a place to go spend that money, run to if they get into trouble, or treated as a captured noble if caught rather than killed outright.I think that 2, 4, and 5 are true for most adventurers but not nessisarily for NPCs. King, god, and country are strong motivators for most people of the age. In a world where the possibility of gods geting angry with you for overthrowing their chosen or oathbreaking is an demonstratable fact may still keep even adventurers in their place.Third, yes, an army will still be needed. You can't send your epic level party of adventurers to every little town to make sure they pay their tribute. Still, I think the place of such elite units will be a common factor in strategy and tactics of such a world. Less soldiers or commoners with weapons might be needed and more highly trained troops. Add in wizards casting some decent leveled spells and it changes the battle field quite a bit. Five low level wizards with wands of fireballs could drastically change a battle field with large amounts of troops in tight formations. All in all, it's probalby a topic that deserves its own thread.I think I would only allow such a thing for when a die was actually rolled instead of taking 10. If you're taking 10 in such a thing as a profession or craft, you're simply redoing what you already know. Economic pressure being what it is, most commoners won't take that chance with getting a bad harvest. Only the bold, well off, or talented would take such chances and be able to push the envelope of what they know.I think I figured in helpers into some of my calculations. One thing I'd think about, is that even if more helpers might not give any more bonus, they could probably be used to cut down on the time it takes. You teach one a simple task, such as the fletcher having them split the feathers, varnishing arrow shafts, or sharpening the heads. It doesn't help the master really turn out any better products but it allows him to turn out more because it frees him of the tedious work. He comes back later and inspects what is done, prehaps rejecting what is not up to his standards. Meanwhile the actual helper is there with him actually acting as an aditional set of hands while he works.Some other professions may require a minimum number of helpers even if they don't add a bonus. e.g. as per the Arms and Equipment guide, only the pilot needs have Profession (Sailor) but he still needs a larger crew to follow orders to actually control the ship. Certain larger forges and foundries might require additional people to pump the bellows. They aren't actually "helping" as they wouldn't add a bonus but trying to do the work without them would be difficult.</blockquote>

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