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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Aulirophile" data-source="post: 5552504" data-attributes="member: 86312">Uh, your anecdotal experience and pointing out PCs get more powers as they level proves diddly. And the fact that you don't even understand the argument (by your own admission) but disagree with it is just sad. How can you possibly competently disagree with something you don't understand?You got options here:Anecdotal Experience Argument: Unless someone else in this thread played 4e for slightly more then 10 hours a day on average for a year, you have nothing to stand on here. Not the best decision of my life but I'll be damned if anyone in this thread can claim more anecdotal experience then I can, so if you want to drag the argument down to that level as if it has some significance: I win. Math: You can clearly see that PCs do not maintain a 55% hit rate vs even level, which is the stated minimum and every bonus (including mundane things like CA) is on top of that. In addition to. So you cannot count that and even then, nothing besides Expertise, no party composition, no leader buffs, nothing else in the entire game fixes this. So yes, the math is proveable, and yes it does so in a vacuum, and no, that doesn't matter, because it is supposed to work regardless of party composition and only does so with Expertise. Developer Statements: 55% vs even level is the minimum and we made a mistake, Expertise is explicitly the fix for this self-admitted mistake. What exactly does it take when the developers said they had a minimum hit% they wanted based on extensive playtesting, the math clearly shows the minimum isn't maintained, the developers said that it was a mistake based on a change (which if they would tell us wtf it was would hopefully settle this debate even in the minds of the most obdurate) and released Expertise as a "fix", their words, and the "fix" neatly closes the gap? Expertise makes the game work as intended. Period. In previous editions Feats like that were considered taxes. So Expertise is a Feat Tax. It is quite possible to do without it (I played for a long time before it was even released) but it is a horrible experience at Epic. I played multiple Epic characters without Expertise vs MM1 Monsters. It was arduous at best. Also, if you really want to mathematically prove that Expertise isn't needed, you need to calculate encounter length for every single party composition with and without it, from 1-30. Just doing a handful should drive the point home: Doesn't work.</blockquote>

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