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<blockquote data-quote="CapnZapp" data-source="post: 6967820" data-attributes="member: 12731"><p>I see. </p><p></p><p>But now you're back to the re-roll. Rerolling damage for a single attack is most often underwhelming, while it might even be overpowered for a high level rogue.</p><p></p><p>Other than that, we would have to clean up the phrasing. It appears you mean all damage dice of an attack, including any riders. Can't remember offhand if we have such an existing ability whose language we can reuse. Also we would need to specify two more things: do you reroll all or some dice? do you keep the new roll or do you get to choose to use either new or old? </p><p></p><p>For a fighter you would rarely see more than d12+d8 (magical weapon with bonus elemental damage die).</p><p></p><p><em>The average damage increase of 2D8, take the highest is 5.81 up from 4.5, which is +1.3</em></p><p><em>The average damage increase of 2D12, take the highest is 8.49 up from 6.5, which is +2</em></p><p></p><p>In total +3.3. Hardly worthwhile. And that's with a rather rare bonus damage die!</p><p></p><p><em>Remember, a level 11 fighter gains +3 just from a Strength ASI. More than +3 in fact, since the higher Strength doesn't just add to damage, it imrpoves your hit chance too.</em></p><p></p><p>For a high-level rogue, on the other hand, you might see 8d6 at circa 15th level. </p><p></p><p><em>The average damage increase of 2D6, take the highest is 4.47 up from 3.5, which is +1</em></p><p></p><p>If you could reroll each d6 in isolation, picking the best result for each die, this would give you +8 which would be nice.</p><p></p><p>But, obviously, you're not really suggesting that. You're suggesting that you reroll all 8d6 and pick the new result. </p><p></p><p>I don't need to do the calculations to tell this will be a lower benefit.</p><p></p><p>I don't need to do calculations either to realize that if you must take the new result, the benefits are even lower, since now you should only use it when you roll lower than average by definition.</p><p></p><p>I'm not telling you this to dump on your proposal Yunru. I'm telling you this to explain that the reroll idea doesn't work. The dice are simply too small. (Small as in the low number of faces). Really, the reroll isn't starting to work well until you reach twenty faces. Which, not coincidentally is why the advantage mechanism works - it is a d20 reroll! <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /></p><p></p><p>I know people (not saying you did this) say "but when I roll a 1 I get to reroll". What these people are forgetting all the times they roll a 9, or a 11, or a 12. In these cases the feature provides absolutely no benefit. The average still remains the same, a very modest increase. </p><p></p><p>Compare a feature that said "you can choose to take maximum damage" or one that said "you can choose to take average damage". </p><p></p><p>Both these do similar things to what the reroll does, only with much more reliable and therefore powerful results.</p><p></p><p>That is why I abandoned the reroll and instead experimented with adding a bonus die.</p><p></p><p>But I will remain open to suggestions.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="CapnZapp, post: 6967820, member: 12731"] I see. But now you're back to the re-roll. Rerolling damage for a single attack is most often underwhelming, while it might even be overpowered for a high level rogue. Other than that, we would have to clean up the phrasing. It appears you mean all damage dice of an attack, including any riders. Can't remember offhand if we have such an existing ability whose language we can reuse. Also we would need to specify two more things: do you reroll all or some dice? do you keep the new roll or do you get to choose to use either new or old? For a fighter you would rarely see more than d12+d8 (magical weapon with bonus elemental damage die). [I]The average damage increase of 2D8, take the highest is 5.81 up from 4.5, which is +1.3 The average damage increase of 2D12, take the highest is 8.49 up from 6.5, which is +2[/I] In total +3.3. Hardly worthwhile. And that's with a rather rare bonus damage die! [I]Remember, a level 11 fighter gains +3 just from a Strength ASI. More than +3 in fact, since the higher Strength doesn't just add to damage, it imrpoves your hit chance too.[/I] For a high-level rogue, on the other hand, you might see 8d6 at circa 15th level. [I]The average damage increase of 2D6, take the highest is 4.47 up from 3.5, which is +1[/I] If you could reroll each d6 in isolation, picking the best result for each die, this would give you +8 which would be nice. But, obviously, you're not really suggesting that. You're suggesting that you reroll all 8d6 and pick the new result. I don't need to do the calculations to tell this will be a lower benefit. I don't need to do calculations either to realize that if you must take the new result, the benefits are even lower, since now you should only use it when you roll lower than average by definition. I'm not telling you this to dump on your proposal Yunru. I'm telling you this to explain that the reroll idea doesn't work. The dice are simply too small. (Small as in the low number of faces). Really, the reroll isn't starting to work well until you reach twenty faces. Which, not coincidentally is why the advantage mechanism works - it is a d20 reroll! :) I know people (not saying you did this) say "but when I roll a 1 I get to reroll". What these people are forgetting all the times they roll a 9, or a 11, or a 12. In these cases the feature provides absolutely no benefit. The average still remains the same, a very modest increase. Compare a feature that said "you can choose to take maximum damage" or one that said "you can choose to take average damage". Both these do similar things to what the reroll does, only with much more reliable and therefore powerful results. That is why I abandoned the reroll and instead experimented with adding a bonus die. But I will remain open to suggestions. [/QUOTE]
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