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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Aegeri" data-source="post: 5535004" data-attributes="member: 78116">Forgive me for derailing your entirely valid point, but actually one of my biggest pet peeves in 4E is that many classes cannot natively make a decent MBA. It is absurd to me, after enough play, that a Battlemind is utterly ineffective at attacking a monster that wants to just move away. For that matter a rogue (non brutal scoundrel anyway) that watches a creature waltz away is equally as silly. It is pretty obvious why every battlemind in my games takes melee training and or uses loadstone lure as their main MBA. Otherwise they end up with a similar - actually much worse - situation to the knight where monsters just shrug and wander off (albeit, with a -2 mark of course <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />).I personally wish, wish upon wish, that most melee classes got errata that let them sub their basic attack for something that is moderately effective without a feat. At minimum, there should be options or class features for non-strength based defenders. Preferably, most classes that are supposed to operate in melee would get them for free and everyone else has melee training (or to use a whacky stat, like a slayer investing entirely in dex only as an example). This is my dream. Also my dream has wizards sending me a free puppy.With air holes in the box this time.Returning to the point, this is true but the knight actually puts the flanking ally in an odd position. Because the knights mark enforcement only goes where the Knight does, the flanking ally can run into massive trouble if the knight gets shoved away. When your rogue is suddenly adjacent to an owlbear by himself because the knight got a 1 square punt from his controller ally, you are all of a sudden in a gigantic world of hurt. Unlike with a regular defender who may not be able to enforce the mark (which isn't always the case, Shielding Swordmages, Paladins and Wardens can affect a creature at range if they have to), they can often at least get the penalty and that can make a huge difference to iterative attacks especially (Elites like the Owlbear are classic examples).</blockquote>

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