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Message: <blockquote data-quote="WalterKovacs" data-source="post: 5545388" data-attributes="member: 63763">Admitedly though, in the specific '3 on 1' type of situation, while the knight may not be able to get their attention, he is more likely to get to hurt those enemies than a weaponmaster would. Assuming the weaponmaster had them all marked (not hard with close bursts), and that the enemy at this point knows about the movement stopping OA, they would probably each shift away or, make normal melee attacks against other enemies if possible. In which case one suffers the interupt, the rest suffer the penalty to the attack, and the inconvenience of avoiding an OA. In the case of the knight, he'd get OAs against each one of them unless they attacked him (or one of them happened to use a forced movement effect ... then again, that enemy at the very least used his attack on the knight, so at least one of them paid attention). The enemies, again assuming they know the knights capabilities, would be able to move away instead of shifting, and not suffer the -2 penalty to attack, true, but the knight would have gotten many more OAs as a result. So, he would have been less controlling and more striking. The knight, in this regard, does have a benefit. OA boosting effects are more likely to benefit the knight because the fighter's OA is, in general, so devastating with it's literal stopping power, that the fighter rarely gets to use it. A knight on the other hand, will probably end up using his OA often enough to warrant feats or items to improve it. Stickiness is an important defender quality, but it isn't the only one. Just like a striker isn't ONLY about the ammount of damage it can dish out (it also needs to be able to get access to the enemies it wants to deal that damage to). So to does the defender's ability to punish enemies make it worthwhile. Stickiness is most important for stopping opponent's from attacking your allies ... but then, killing them also works. A defender that enemies repeatedly allow to beat them up has a whole other set of strenghs, with any dpr improvements being much more valuable for a knight. Depending on the group, the knight could be a very striker leaning defender, getting many attacks per round do to his "weaker" defending skills.  Not every monster has forced movement, and unless the forced movement is basically free (aura/OA/interupt/minor), it's still wasting it's action on the knight, which DOES seem to be the idea. One enemy is able to waste the knights actions ... and one enemy can absorb the only interupt coming from the weaponmaster and the rest can shift or attack someone else in melee with less effort. True, they lack the ability to just walk away afterwards ... but then again the forced movement on the weaponmaster would have resulted in nearly the same thing. The -2 will matter ... once in every ten rolls.  So if the scenario is: 3 enemies adjacent to fighter, fighter has all three marked (or in aura), gets pushed away by 1, the other two do what they want ... this needs to happen 5 times before the mark matters on one of the attacks (not actually the case, but over a long enough period of time, there would be an average of one miss caused by the mark continuing to apply when they are out of the aura for every 5 instances of this scenario playing out). Now, this also supposes that the fighter has enough burst attacks or other tricks to repeatedly create the scenario ... since, presumably, the enemies with forced movement aren't showing up in every fight.</blockquote>

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