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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Upper_Krust" data-source="post: 2697856" data-attributes="member: 326">Hey Shemmy mate! <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />I was replying specifically to Rips incorrect critique of 1st Edition, thats why I brought it up.What on Earth are you talking about! They are far more insightful and logical than that Planescape pap you keep touting, which, I could just as easily state is not relevant being 1.5 editions past its prime. My distaste of 2nd Edition stems primarily from its removal of deity stats, its fundamentalist placating ways and mucking about with what was an already logical cosmology.Planescape I didn't like for two reasons, one, that it made the planes 'cuddly' by allowing low-level characters to traipse about. However, in saying that, if I had been in charge of Planescape I would have done exactly the same thing, so I uderstand the design decision, but that doesn't mean I have to personally like it. The second is its continuance of the 2nd Edition deity agenda which helped no one. Its the only edition with the logical cosmology as far as I can see. 2nd Edition was pretty much first edition with all the deities and demon lords physically removed. Given that our group were playing in an epic, and later an immortal campaign, its no wonder I see 2nd Edition as D&D's Dark Ages.3rd Edition hasn't borrowed anything I hated from 2nd Edition as far as I can tell. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> I'm familiar with 2nd Edition/Planescape, I just don't live by it, like you. I don't have every Planescape supplement, but I have enough to know I don't like it that much.I don't see it as anything to do with editions as much as it has to do with logic and practicality.2nd editions treatment of deities (and to an extent its cosmology) is simply not practical for anyone who wants to use deities in a physical capacity.3rd Edition had the right ideas (the stats approach) but its execution was lacking (no rules for how to become an immortal for instance, among numerous other faults). I don't see why you have cause for lamenting...you're not still upset about that whole 'kosmically' business are you?  Funnily enough the only time I ever have to make such a thing 'clear' is when I have been replying to 'hater' comments about stats for gods from you or your insidious confederates.I wasn't going to bring it up until Rip started with his "we don't need stats, use your imagination and make them up yourself for God's sake!" diatribe.Is that your Roger Moore impression? (The actor not the editor I mean)I'm merely defending immortal gaming from your embittered allies remarks.Well established in Planescape I would envision perhaps, but I don't use that work as my gospel.I've stated many times that fiends ability to produce offspring (while unnecessary in my opinion) is of no consequence beyond whether or not it can be used to gain an advantage in resources by the planar rulers. Which even Rip seems to agree it cannot. But he keeps bringing the matter up, so I didn't want to seem impolite by not replying to that particular point after he'd taken the time to post on it.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /></blockquote>

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