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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Upper_Krust" data-source="post: 2699754" data-attributes="member: 326">Hey Rip! <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> The idea assumed you had a rival demon princes army attacking. With an infinite number of troops (each) the two armies keep crashing against each other for an eternity. Agreed, reading over 1st Edition Manual of the Planes it appears that the great majority of the inhabitants of Orcus plane are indeed undead. Absolutely. I'm sure they only touch on the idea rather than define it. Exactly, and as a rule they generally adapt to their environment.The point was, that if people don't thrive in an area they won't gather in it.A few posts ago you told me to 'make them up and use my imagination for God's sake', or was that just a flight of fancy?Breeding fiends work in so far as the idea can't be used to a planar rulers advantage - in that I agree with you.Infinite planes and layers work, my beef is more with the idea of infinite realms. Even assuming the demon princes do control their layers infinitude, the idea is totally impractical because they don't have infinite resources to populate it. Which means that, at best they populate an infinitely small fraction of their layer. So propagating the idea is redundant. Even if we entertain the notion, it doesn't benefit us in anyway. No one can ever map out an entire infinite layer. I am sure there are any number of words that could be used. I fail to see how one, in this case, is worse than another. I think kosmic (and its derivatives) is an interesting word.But is there any reason why, say for instance, a demon prince could not choose to create a realm in the same fashion as a deity.I quite liked the idea that they 'burn it away' - nice. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> But thats the main crux of it, to allow an infinite number of cosmologies to co-exist.For instance, you could travel to the Warhammer World or any number of Moorcockian Planets and become aware of their particular Gods of Chaos. I don't see it solving anything practical though.  Why would he be aware of them all? Or more to the point why would they be aware of him necessarily!? I think, as with Q1: Queen of the Demonweb Pits, the more powerful princes are known on a number of worlds (it was about 8 or so mentioned for Lolth for instance), one or two of which they may actually have conquered, in others they may be allied with one nation, in yet others they may only have token investment. We know that demons do not necessarily, as a rule, have a monopoly on any given planet, so I wouldn't go along with this approach. I would challenge that infinite number of Abyssal Lords theory. I think the 66 princes (incorporating the 6 monarchs) and 666 Lords is enough.We could, but I don't think it is necessary. I would incorporate numerology into this sort of exercise, but of course there is nothing to say that all kosmically localised areas have the same number of layers. There may be four hells (north, south, east, west - as per Goetia) in some for instance.If we use this scenario it doesn't really lend itself to any practical applications (as you yourself agree below).Surely the kosmically localised system is more akin to this idea? This is sort of the assumption I would also make, although I wouldn't necessarily say the universe is technically infinite, but I would say that its so big that debating the point is moot.Now you are seeing my point.  For me, this post has been the most interesting of our recent tete-a-tetes.Ideally you want all such beings to be able to interact (epic PCs, deities, planar lords etc.) if you are going to bother with such levels of power in the first place. Pretty much, yes. Thinking about it, you could still have the realm infinite (although the populated area of the realm would still be finite) using the kosmically localised approach, however once a second kosmology became known, the realms would conjoin (two infinities are still infinite after all).Possibly, but at least everything will be of a finite size, so at least we can deal with it practically.Agreed. The complications only arise when you actually need to start explaining it for immortal characters (encompassing demon lords, deities, elemental masters and so forth), which obviously you don't really need to do unless they are going to be used in a physical capacity. So its something you can easily ignore up to that point.</blockquote>

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