Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Upper_Krust" data-source="post: 2705041" data-attributes="member: 326">Hey Rip! <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />If a mere demon lord, like Juiblex is a Lesser Power then the Dukes of Hell should also be considered Lesser Powers.Personally though, I see them as quasi-deities, but thats just me. Regardless, the dukes of Hell are going to be a factor in the battle. I don't know if they are used to fighting as a team. Likely Gruumsh, Baghtru and Ilneval. Remember also that a few of them don't have the Hells as their home plane.Well we have to negate that 'can't be killed jive' for Gruumsh.Anything where theres no risk is pointless.I'm talking about picking a fight with him directly. Of course Demogorgon, or more likely his followers/servants, can be at odds with mortals who worship any of the norse gods.I loved it...as you might imagine. It has that 'anything goes' approach. Prior to reading it I had never read Lovecraft or played Call of Cthulhu (even though I knew the inspiration behind the Old Ones), so many of the references seemed fresh to me.Thats one way of looking at it. Although I don't see the General as Infestix equal (though the point is moot I suppose). In the book I described the politics of Hell akin to a Feudal society with a King, but powerful noble lords who control ttheir own lands and pay him fealty. I don't think Asmodeus could overthrow one of the other factions and remain in power, but I think he could certainly defend against another faction.Agreed. However, D&D cosmology isn't necessarily like this. Although you could argue Lucifer is the true master of Hell (did you ever read the old Dragon magazine article on him?). Wasn't there Baernoloth stats printed in Planescape (I vaguely recall them) but they were just total pants? If the General off Gehenna rules an entire plane and Demogorgon, or Asmodeus for that matter, do not. Why should they all be of equal power? Thats totally dependant upon an individual campaigns cosmology though. Its also dependant on what exactly makes a greater power (I wouldn't have Set as a greater power for instance).I suspect Sytgia will still be here long after Levistus is not.I still don't see how you can interpret that sentence like that. If it didn't have the word 'would' in it I would agree with you...but it does.<img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin    :D"  data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" />So, try again in another 100 years. Demogorgon will be ready and better prepared.That just seems innappropriate as far as I can see. They should be severely weakened, what you suggest is like a gentle slap on the wrist. The deity has to risk something.The book doesn't imply that at all, and it takes a whole new paragraph to divide being slain on a non-native plane and being slain on their native plane. It certainly never says they should be powered up on their home plane directly after being killed on a non-native plane. Exactly, thats why theres the miss chance, you only get a split second to act on it.He arrives directly in Heironeous rejuvenation chamber (pending the successful mishap roll).Heironeous would be rejuvenating, so he couldn't follow a defeated Demogorgons silver cord. So he won't know where his hideout is.The cosmology was perfect, yes. But I can see a few improvements in the immortal mechanics. Even if we adhere rigidly to MotP for the purposes of the argument, once they incapacitate Gruumsh they could always launch a jihad on orcs everywhere so that when Gruumsh is back on his feet he is really weakened. Yes, but Heironeous attack was unprovoked. Demogorgons was merely retaliatory.I'd have Indrajit and Kumbakarna as Lesser Deities of Gehenna. As long as he wasn't fighting on Indra's home plane he would have a good chance.  Yes but the problems seem more like errata in waiting than fundamental reversals of policy.  True, but its not going to be easy. Acererak was just a lich after all. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />In 1st Edition you divide by 4.5 to get Hit Dice.</blockquote>

Verification