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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Steelwill" data-source="post: 5833143" data-attributes="member: 90458">Ideally it would be cool if both classes at high levels are able to sunder the heavens, one with might the other with magic (ok both probably with magic, just one with a magic sword and biceps the size of volkswagons).  What 4e did however was instead of bringing the fighter up to the epic level and scale that magic in 3.5 allowed, it neutered the casters, spells, and most of what magic could even do in order to achieve its touted balance.  This is completely unacceptable as an approach when designing A) a fantasy game, because in fantasy magic > all, and scale should be Asura's Wrath level and up.  B) a game which is supposedly only limited by our imaginations.  4E did not do a service to fighters, it did a disservice to casters and magic across the board.  Fighters should be made better, not everything magical made worse to make them seem/feel better.  Lowering the bar instead of raising it fails for everyone, and is very much the reason why only 4 short years after release 4E is already being succeeded.  My 2 cents.TL;DR: Fighters should legitimately be made better.  This is not the same thing as making casters and magic in general all worse. Bring the fighter up, not pull the magic down.</blockquote>