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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Victim" data-source="post: 1263022" data-attributes="member: 78">The difference between Heavy armor or not is 1 whole point of AC and some Dex buffs.  Add up the Max Dex and AC bonus on armors.  Full Plate and Padded total at 9, most others at 8.  So Barbarian AC potentially a mere 3 points lower during rages.  While significant, it's not like arbs are running around naked getting hit by everything while stuff bounces off a fighter's plate.  Barbarians can usually rage for more than one fight, since they get extra rages with levels and can take that extra rage feat.  So, if you want to change your statement to: "Barbarian can dish out more damage than fighters during critical encounters, but will have slightly impaired performance in other fights.  Meanwhile, a fighter will be impressively medicore in all fights."  A second level spell ruins fighter's too: Hold Person.  Calm Emotions has a save, so if an enemy can land it, they could have landed Hold, Charm, Dominate, etc.  Oh, and since raging adds to Will saves, it's actually easier to disable the fighter with such spells.While a paladin might not have the same physical stats as a pure fighter, they should still be respectable.  Divine Might lets a paladin use his CHA for damage too, which somwhat makes up for the lack of physical stats.  And fighters can't match a paladin's lance charging except at low levels.  At higher levels, most mounts will need the extra HD and such in order to survive.  But the real difference is the saves.  A fighter can do all that a paladin can, except resist those pesky spells, spell like abilities, and assorted other tricks.Battle clerics using self buffs generally have enough spells left over for some healing, divination, and other stuff.  In some cases, the cleric could uber buff himself, pass some nice spells to the group, and still have a heal and some flamestrikes.  And there are defenses against dispelling too.  The same rings of spell turning or counterspelling that make up for the fighter's weak saves send the dispels right back at their casters.</blockquote>

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