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Message: <blockquote data-quote="insanogeddon" data-source="post: 4715639" data-attributes="member: 82822">Disagree.My ever in flux group we have played all the 1 - 20 modules (finishing off the latest) and most assuredly always have campaigns that go 1 to 20 module or not, whether we need to change dms or not.  2x we even went epic (22 and 25th level respectively).Warriors often outshine the casters.  Unless casters are mollycoddled. If you insist on comparing base classes naked then casters cannot cast as they have no components.  INATE in the system are wealth tables per level, items, artefacts, and character interactions. If a 12th + level character has not got the respect/indebtment of MANY a church/organisation/person it begs the question how you got to that level.  If your group cannot cast a spell you really should be able to go to many, many npcs that can.  Look at big business/governments or any other powerful entities... they trade/they assist eachother.  Why would a campaign treat pcs differently? All our gm/dms understand the dynamic.  PCs aren't bubble boys who cannot touch foreign objects the entire universe is out to scupper nor are they protected by bubbles that are immune to highlevel, powerful opponents with tactical experience and intelegence. If your at 12+ level play and the opponents cannot teleport thru or fly over puny wall spells, have spell resistance etc etc what opponents do you fight?   gobilins? If they aren't practiced at targeting or dispelling highly magical threats or using spells like 'protection from good/evil' to negate summoned goons (or big enough to swat puny summoned critters) they would already be extinct (just like pcs that never dispel the big bads, or non-flying non casting non trading plains dwelling monsters). There are wealth tables for a REASON.  You remove that its unbalanced.  The 15th fighter should have his helm of teleport/cloak of the monte bank, ring of free action, boots of fly, potion of invis etc.   I have yet to see the caster (their not the best at spotting) not surrounded by companions that survives the invisible highly intelegent and experienced demons full attack.  For that matter they struggle when visible demons/devils port in beside each party member... not to mention grapple (you can lock mouths shut with a sucesful check as well as do damage under the rules).  Along with silence casters are really walking dead without a silent d.door or 3 or other get out of/avoid jail card. 5 pcs teleport into your room (all buffed no doubt).. run, exp.  if your the demon/dragon with teleport/d.door and a good speed.  Come back in 10. Its the campaigns and so the dm/gms fault if this discrepancy in fighter uselessness occurs.  Stick to the rules and you will be fine, it all sorta balances and they all need eachother, some luck and alot of wit! I have indeedy played in groups where the dm biases the casters... they never get dispelled/grappled despite it being THE obvious tactic exp. from the average bad guys who inevitably are higher level and strong.  Yet every fighter weakness is targeted. In these campaigns the fighter probably gets no items and cannot arrange thru the connections and respect built from a life time of heroics/horrors some equipment.The world even is not oblivious: there are gods and epic entities... gods want powerful souls, entities want power/lackies etc.  The best sports stars get sponsered and companies don't even get to keep their souls (? perhaps).   Its quite sane to allow a limited planetery resource like a ~15th level character to have connections he can PAY to get equipment necessary to fulfill the intended design of the game you chose to engage with. Its amazing how a dm that knows his spells (and feats and weapons for that matter) and sticks to the rules and has a sense of cause and effect equalises said rort cheated discrepancy.  Woe to me : (</blockquote>

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