Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Manbearcat" data-source="post: 6186915" data-attributes="member: 6696971">Hey N'raac.  I've seen you invoke this before as your reasoning for it to be reasonable for the world to have a tour de force of understanding and security measures against Spellcasters; Magic items are pervasive, therefore (presumably) wizards, as a percentage of the population, is not some outrageously remote number.  However, it really fails to consider a primary vector, that being time.  Consider the FR timeline alone.  You're talking 300000 + years of spellcasting and magic item creation, empires rising and falling to ruin, some being erased from the annals of history.  Time could (probably should) be the primary reason for an influx of magic items into the world economy.  At any point in history there could be an extremely remote number of spellcasters as a percentage of the populace and still there would be an easy explanation for the number of magic items.  Adventurers unearthing ancient ruins and pillaging tombs has always been my explanation for any magic item prevalence.  There doesn't need to be an assumption of a spellcasting as a widely practiced art.  The only reason I could see the need for spellcasting as a widely practiced art in setting, and therefore commonly understood by wayfolk (who may be subjected to a Charm Person spell and then be suspicious), or therefore have all of these prolific security measures and contingencies specifically against spellcasters is to justify gross metagame strategic prep against spellcasters and ad-hoc, antagonistic GMing toward spellcasters specifically...and that being a 2nd order function of needing to rein in their outrageous power disparity with respect to mundane characters.  How any GM manages this for any length of time without illiciting constant facepalms, eyerolls, SMHs from spellcaster players when any number of layfolks, steadings, keeps, BBEG lairs routinely have a "How to Nerf Spellcasters and Use Setting as Justifica ERRRRRR How to Properly Secure Your Mind and Your Home Against Spellcasters" is beyond me.  In my experience, any percentage of tavern-members approaching double digits that understands Charm Person, any percentage of lairs that are loaded to the teeth with anti-wizard contingencies (nondetection, alarm, anti-magic zones, anti-teleportation stuff) yields dissatisfication evolving into distrust evolving into disdain from spellcaster players (and fairly so I'd say).Every time I see these threads in action it just reconfirms what an issue powerful, unbalanced spellcasters are (which I have an absurd amount of empirical evidence to support as I've GMed a ridiculous number of hours with them in my games).  The answer is inevitably "play strategic rock/paper/scissors with spellcasters when you prep your game (excruciating and not how I want to spend my time) and then adjust on the fly for the areas that you've missed during actual play".  The mere fact that this is the answer to spellcasters (and the answer never works to address the horrible conflict-of-interest internally for the GM and the gross distrust, and passive-aggressiveness this inevitably sows at the table) but for no one else should reveal that Something Is Rotten in Denmark.  Disturbing levels of unbounded, asymmetrical warfare resources (siloed into one group specifically) that circumvents some or all action resolution mechanics is problematic at the table (to say the least).And we can do any number of these scenarios.  Of course if we impose more and more specifics, more and more contingencies, things go pear-shaped...thats basically tautological.  The point of the exercise is always to convey the potency and breadth of the "answer to all problems" inherent in the spellcasting system.  The answer of (i) setting justification for everyone having a hefty understanding of spellcasting and contingencies/securities against, (ii) rock/paper/scissors prep, prep, prep, more prep and fudge ERRR adjust on the fly, (iii) give martial characters a ridiculous number of magic items (ginormously outside of WBL numbers) in order to break the saving throw system (which means nothing against no-save spells of which are everywhere) are answers that some folks aren't particularly enamored with.</blockquote>

Verification