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Fighters vs. Spellcasters (a case for fighters.)
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<blockquote data-quote="N'raac" data-source="post: 6186973" data-attributes="member: 6681948"><p>The Planar Binding series is dicy at best:</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>You might be waiting a while to get that creature to agree to serve you. Hope you aren't under any time pressure.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>5% shot every attempt that the creature can flee or attack immediately - and you with no fighter!</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>So, how many times do you pull that stunt without a group of your former victims coming after you?</p><p></p><p>As for Summon, I do so love full round casting times.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>In my books, any feat which is a must have should be downgraded. No option should be a no brainer. With Spell Mastery, limited access and a full round for any but the Mastered spells, I don't find this feat the same WotC's Gift to Wizards you consider it to be.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>No, it's the reason Dragons need not waste a feat on Blindsense. Spectral Hands don't hold up well to breath weapons. Dragons move fast and cover large areas. If there's a nice, straight line of sight between you and a Dragon, and he was not caught unawares, I'd bet he's in range to breath weapon and either flee or close the gap for melee as he sees fit. Dragons also have pretty decent mental stats. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>There are mundane means of locating the appropriate location, or determining where to cast spells. Funny, the bloodhounds/rangers/whatever track them this far, then there are no more prints/tracks/scents leading away. And they don't have to find their attackers to plan, reinforce, bolster their defenses or just leave - likely with whatever they had that lead you here in the first place.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>If you're running through my home, killing and looting, I'd call you a marauder. If you're not an adventurer, then the game gets pretty dull. I'm not sure where you see Permanency being needed - but if you and your group cannot imagine using non-magical means to accomplish anything but infliction of damage, I can see where you would start to see spellcasters as unbeatable.</p><p></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">Good luck with that...</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'">My targets are generally not selected based on who's easy to hit. Who's the greatest threat ranks a lot higher. You vastly overestimate the defense of the Wizard. At least as compared to any game I've played in or run.</span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"></span></p><p></p><p>As we will never game together, I suppose we will never know, will we? </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Wizards have a habit of dumping STR. That makes STR damage a pretty serious threat.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Sometimes, yes. Other times, the opponent can get lucky. That breath weapon gets the wizard and his images, so who cares if the Dragon knows which is which? Or he just SHUTS HIS EYES and uses Blindsense.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>As I said, if we assume there are very few spellcasters, that makes the spells much more mysterious. But it also begs the question how the wizard (or anyone else) finds exactly the spells and items he wants, when he wants and has the gold for them. Why is there such a ready market if no one can identify them, make use of them, etc.? Why is it so easy to locate weird spell components? And how do PC's have such standard knowledge of magical abilities if they are rare in the extreme? For that matter, how did all those unbeatable mages if the past fail to rule the world? Why aren't elves and liches in charge?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Seems like a dissatisfaction that the wizard is not simply allowed to be omnipotent. The Forgotten Realms you use as an example seem pretty chock-full of spellcasters, in my experience. If there's a ready market for magic items, I'd expect some public awareness of them, and I'd expect planners and tacticians to consider those abilities. It seems like "magic is dripping from the trees" is very popular when the spellcaster wants a scroll of a specific 5th or 6th level spell (or a gross of Cure Light Wounds wands), but not so popular when the ramifications stop working entirely in their favour.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Since every one of them has Blindsense, why would they be motivated to waste a feat on it?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>So creating an opponent that can, in some way, challenge the omnipotence of your spellcaster demonstrates "a poor sense of balance"? Seems like a double standard there - why would a player with any sense of balance intentionally create an omnipotent wizard? Why would he expect the rules options available not to be constrained, to reduce or remove truly broken combinations? </p><p></p><p>I'm still trying to figure out why the dragon chooses a lair that those annoying humanoids can access so easily. And look at those Sorcerer levels - Alarm should be as or more universal to dragons as Uncanny Forethought is to wizards. It's not like they can use L1 spells for combat by the time they get them! [A Dragon using Rope Trick - there's an amusing picture!]</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="N'raac, post: 6186973, member: 6681948"] The Planar Binding series is dicy at best: You might be waiting a while to get that creature to agree to serve you. Hope you aren't under any time pressure. 5% shot every attempt that the creature can flee or attack immediately - and you with no fighter! So, how many times do you pull that stunt without a group of your former victims coming after you? As for Summon, I do so love full round casting times. In my books, any feat which is a must have should be downgraded. No option should be a no brainer. With Spell Mastery, limited access and a full round for any but the Mastered spells, I don't find this feat the same WotC's Gift to Wizards you consider it to be. No, it's the reason Dragons need not waste a feat on Blindsense. Spectral Hands don't hold up well to breath weapons. Dragons move fast and cover large areas. If there's a nice, straight line of sight between you and a Dragon, and he was not caught unawares, I'd bet he's in range to breath weapon and either flee or close the gap for melee as he sees fit. Dragons also have pretty decent mental stats. There are mundane means of locating the appropriate location, or determining where to cast spells. Funny, the bloodhounds/rangers/whatever track them this far, then there are no more prints/tracks/scents leading away. And they don't have to find their attackers to plan, reinforce, bolster their defenses or just leave - likely with whatever they had that lead you here in the first place. If you're running through my home, killing and looting, I'd call you a marauder. If you're not an adventurer, then the game gets pretty dull. I'm not sure where you see Permanency being needed - but if you and your group cannot imagine using non-magical means to accomplish anything but infliction of damage, I can see where you would start to see spellcasters as unbeatable. [FONT=Verdana] Good luck with that... My targets are generally not selected based on who's easy to hit. Who's the greatest threat ranks a lot higher. You vastly overestimate the defense of the Wizard. At least as compared to any game I've played in or run. [/FONT] As we will never game together, I suppose we will never know, will we? Wizards have a habit of dumping STR. That makes STR damage a pretty serious threat. Sometimes, yes. Other times, the opponent can get lucky. That breath weapon gets the wizard and his images, so who cares if the Dragon knows which is which? Or he just SHUTS HIS EYES and uses Blindsense. As I said, if we assume there are very few spellcasters, that makes the spells much more mysterious. But it also begs the question how the wizard (or anyone else) finds exactly the spells and items he wants, when he wants and has the gold for them. Why is there such a ready market if no one can identify them, make use of them, etc.? Why is it so easy to locate weird spell components? And how do PC's have such standard knowledge of magical abilities if they are rare in the extreme? For that matter, how did all those unbeatable mages if the past fail to rule the world? Why aren't elves and liches in charge? Seems like a dissatisfaction that the wizard is not simply allowed to be omnipotent. The Forgotten Realms you use as an example seem pretty chock-full of spellcasters, in my experience. If there's a ready market for magic items, I'd expect some public awareness of them, and I'd expect planners and tacticians to consider those abilities. It seems like "magic is dripping from the trees" is very popular when the spellcaster wants a scroll of a specific 5th or 6th level spell (or a gross of Cure Light Wounds wands), but not so popular when the ramifications stop working entirely in their favour. Since every one of them has Blindsense, why would they be motivated to waste a feat on it? So creating an opponent that can, in some way, challenge the omnipotence of your spellcaster demonstrates "a poor sense of balance"? Seems like a double standard there - why would a player with any sense of balance intentionally create an omnipotent wizard? Why would he expect the rules options available not to be constrained, to reduce or remove truly broken combinations? I'm still trying to figure out why the dragon chooses a lair that those annoying humanoids can access so easily. And look at those Sorcerer levels - Alarm should be as or more universal to dragons as Uncanny Forethought is to wizards. It's not like they can use L1 spells for combat by the time they get them! [A Dragon using Rope Trick - there's an amusing picture!] [/QUOTE]
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