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Fighters vs. Spellcasters (a case for fighters.)
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<blockquote data-quote="N'raac" data-source="post: 6190693" data-attributes="member: 6681948"><p>I don’t see a 0 level spell with an array of different effects and a pretty decent duration masking or disguising the scent of a creature. That’s too big an impact considering how many creatures are significantly reliant on scents for perception. Clean and remove that three day funk? Sure. Make you invisible to a guard dog or bloodhound? Not so much. Trick the dog into thinking you smell like a baked potato? No, I don’t think so.</p><p></p><p>Minor tricks with severe limitations. It can flavour, so it can disguise taste, closely related to smell, so I’ll grant it could make its 1 lb limit smell, as well as taste, lemony fresh. It can clean, 1 cubic foot per round.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Why would a magical effect automatically beat the mundane? Acid Splash manages 1-3 damage, which isn’t as good as a vial of acid. Why would a much broader spell be able to readily beat a narrower mundane activity at achieving its purpose? It says “clean”, not “clean better than any mundane cleaning possibly could”.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I don’t see combat speeds as indicative of strolling speeds. A walk is one move action per round, a hustle is two. Is the Lizard hustling? That seems more likely to attract attention.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>On what do you base this argument? There is nothing in the spell description which resolved this, so once again we are back to interpretation. The wizard is undertaking an action which requires the target to make a saving throw. I call that an attack.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Agreed – you can move the lizard up to 100 feet from the Jar, and can cast the spell (and logically, then, return to your body) from up to 200’ away – but where did you leave the Jar before moving 200’ away from it? In any case, up to 300’ is the definite limit for your L10 wizard.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>No, it is dismissal of the spell. You can end Magic Jar early by returning to your body, but you can’t Dismiss it.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I am pointing out that nothing in the spell provides you the ability to order the steed around. It can be ridden by you or the person you designate in casting the spell. We have rules for riding – they are in the Ride skill. The rider directs the horse.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Again, is there a PC understanding of the metaphysics, or is this a metagame measure for in-game actions? Does a character losing a level due to an Undead attack know how many XP he lost, or that there has been a drain on his very life force? And which does he perceive casting a spell with an xp cost to have?</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>OK – now I’m waiting for the dog who perceives his master to treat him like a stranger after he takes a shower. Not an issue I am familiar with, I’m afraid. Maybe Cat 2 is afraid he's next for the bath...</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="N'raac, post: 6190693, member: 6681948"] I don’t see a 0 level spell with an array of different effects and a pretty decent duration masking or disguising the scent of a creature. That’s too big an impact considering how many creatures are significantly reliant on scents for perception. Clean and remove that three day funk? Sure. Make you invisible to a guard dog or bloodhound? Not so much. Trick the dog into thinking you smell like a baked potato? No, I don’t think so. Minor tricks with severe limitations. It can flavour, so it can disguise taste, closely related to smell, so I’ll grant it could make its 1 lb limit smell, as well as taste, lemony fresh. It can clean, 1 cubic foot per round. Why would a magical effect automatically beat the mundane? Acid Splash manages 1-3 damage, which isn’t as good as a vial of acid. Why would a much broader spell be able to readily beat a narrower mundane activity at achieving its purpose? It says “clean”, not “clean better than any mundane cleaning possibly could”. I don’t see combat speeds as indicative of strolling speeds. A walk is one move action per round, a hustle is two. Is the Lizard hustling? That seems more likely to attract attention. On what do you base this argument? There is nothing in the spell description which resolved this, so once again we are back to interpretation. The wizard is undertaking an action which requires the target to make a saving throw. I call that an attack. Agreed – you can move the lizard up to 100 feet from the Jar, and can cast the spell (and logically, then, return to your body) from up to 200’ away – but where did you leave the Jar before moving 200’ away from it? In any case, up to 300’ is the definite limit for your L10 wizard. No, it is dismissal of the spell. You can end Magic Jar early by returning to your body, but you can’t Dismiss it. I am pointing out that nothing in the spell provides you the ability to order the steed around. It can be ridden by you or the person you designate in casting the spell. We have rules for riding – they are in the Ride skill. The rider directs the horse. Again, is there a PC understanding of the metaphysics, or is this a metagame measure for in-game actions? Does a character losing a level due to an Undead attack know how many XP he lost, or that there has been a drain on his very life force? And which does he perceive casting a spell with an xp cost to have? OK – now I’m waiting for the dog who perceives his master to treat him like a stranger after he takes a shower. Not an issue I am familiar with, I’m afraid. Maybe Cat 2 is afraid he's next for the bath... [/QUOTE]
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