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Fighters vs. Spellcasters (a case for fighters.)
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<blockquote data-quote="ImperatorK" data-source="post: 6194159" data-attributes="member: 6695799"><p>Then he should know that I'm not making assertions. There's more than enough proof on the internet.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Years of theoretical and practical analysis consolidated by thousand of gamers around the world disagree with you. And existence of 4ed implies that WotC kinda does too.</p><p></p><p> </p><p> Which WotC apparently cares about, otherwise they wouldn't made 4ed the way it is (more balanced [but in the process also kinda boring and bland]).</p><p></p><p></p><p> Magic can be justified, but non-magic can't. Why exactly? That's a fluff thing, not system thing.</p><p> </p><p></p><p> Huh. You didn't deny that there is a flaw.</p><p>Wouldn't it be better if there was no flaw, rather than us wasting time on fixing it yourself?</p><p></p><p></p><p>Except the fault doesn't lie in my ineptness, but in flaws inherent in the game.</p><p></p><p> </p><p>If I'm not having fun in a game because I'm simply not good enough at it, then that's on me. If I want to have fun I'm gonna need to get better.</p><p> If OTOH I'm not having fun because of the game's flaws, then it's on the game. I think it's pretty straightforward and selfexplanatory.</p><p></p><p> </p><p>Um, no. Sometimes your opponents have class levels, so maybe there's something to it, but the need for balance between classes isn't due to some PvP matches. Not in the slightest.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Nah, that's just you putting words in my mouth.</p><p></p><p></p><p>In a perfect world everyone is happy and has fun with what they've got. Unfortunately the world isn't perfect.</p><p> When I'm playing a Fighter whose entire shtick is to be good (or even the best) at fighting and the Druid's animal companion (which is just one class feature) or the Druid in wildshape is outdoing me, on top of being able to do all the other things he can do (with his spells, because MAGIC), then that kinda puts a damper on my fun, because it's not fun feeling useless or inferior. You can even call it jealousy if you want. Either way I'm having less (or no) fun.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Ignorance of proof does not equal absence of proof. Read up on the subject and then get back to me.</p><p></p><p></p><p>So your experience trumps the collective experience of thousands of people? Wow.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Here's the things that I don't get, tho.</p><p> Firstly - what makes you so sure that the problem lies on our part or that there is no problem? A lot of people see problems. What. Are we (people that complain about the balance) all imagining things or doing something wrong? Or maybe, <em>just maybe</em>, it's <em>you</em> who simply don't see?</p><p>Secondly - what' wrong with changing the whole game? Why are you so opposed to that? It changes nothing for people who have no problems, but helps people who do.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="ImperatorK, post: 6194159, member: 6695799"] Then he should know that I'm not making assertions. There's more than enough proof on the internet. Years of theoretical and practical analysis consolidated by thousand of gamers around the world disagree with you. And existence of 4ed implies that WotC kinda does too. Which WotC apparently cares about, otherwise they wouldn't made 4ed the way it is (more balanced [but in the process also kinda boring and bland]). Magic can be justified, but non-magic can't. Why exactly? That's a fluff thing, not system thing. Huh. You didn't deny that there is a flaw. Wouldn't it be better if there was no flaw, rather than us wasting time on fixing it yourself? Except the fault doesn't lie in my ineptness, but in flaws inherent in the game. If I'm not having fun in a game because I'm simply not good enough at it, then that's on me. If I want to have fun I'm gonna need to get better. If OTOH I'm not having fun because of the game's flaws, then it's on the game. I think it's pretty straightforward and selfexplanatory. Um, no. Sometimes your opponents have class levels, so maybe there's something to it, but the need for balance between classes isn't due to some PvP matches. Not in the slightest. Nah, that's just you putting words in my mouth. In a perfect world everyone is happy and has fun with what they've got. Unfortunately the world isn't perfect. When I'm playing a Fighter whose entire shtick is to be good (or even the best) at fighting and the Druid's animal companion (which is just one class feature) or the Druid in wildshape is outdoing me, on top of being able to do all the other things he can do (with his spells, because MAGIC), then that kinda puts a damper on my fun, because it's not fun feeling useless or inferior. You can even call it jealousy if you want. Either way I'm having less (or no) fun. Ignorance of proof does not equal absence of proof. Read up on the subject and then get back to me. So your experience trumps the collective experience of thousands of people? Wow. Here's the things that I don't get, tho. Firstly - what makes you so sure that the problem lies on our part or that there is no problem? A lot of people see problems. What. Are we (people that complain about the balance) all imagining things or doing something wrong? Or maybe, [I]just maybe[/I], it's [I]you[/I] who simply don't see? Secondly - what' wrong with changing the whole game? Why are you so opposed to that? It changes nothing for people who have no problems, but helps people who do. [/QUOTE]
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