D&D 3E/3.5 Figuring out a role for my 3.5e Cleric

[DarkMoon250]

Hello. I recently got into a 3.5e campaign, but it crashed and burned. Luckily, someone swooped in and brought me into their own 3.5e game, and it looks like this one will actually work out.

I'm wanting to build a level 5 Cleric, maybe with some prestige class thrown in if that would be a good choice. I'm attempting to figure out what role I should take in the party based on my stats, which would be 15, 14, 13, 13, 13, 13 before any level-based or racial-based increases. I'm interested in playing an elf, half-human elf, raptoran, lycanthrope (or quasilycanthrope) or aasimar (on that note, I should say that we are using level adjustment buyoff rules). We start with 12,500 gold. We also get 2 traits, 2 flaws, and a 1st level feat for each flaw.

The other players will be a Paladin, Fighter, and Sorcerer with a focus on debuffs. I'm also wanting to go with 3.5e's rendition of the raptoran god Tuilviel, the elven god Sehanine Moonbow, or the universal god Selune for my Cleric's deity, so in terms of domains, the ones they offer are the ones I want to choose from. I feel like some form of buffer/support is probably the best way to go here, but I'm not sure.

If anyone could share some advice on how to go about building this character, it'd be much appreciated.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Besides the suggestions from your prior thread, you should try to find out about the new DM’s campaign setting. The more you know about IT, the more you’ll have insight as to the kind of PCs likely to be in the world. If the DM hates using Undead, you might consider feats that let yo burn Turns for other mystical effects. If the DM prefers undead heavy games, Extra Turning could be a literal life saver.

 

[James Gasik]

There's a few ways to build a Cleric in 3.5. You can build yourself for melee superiority or ally support fairly easily. I wouldn't bother with Turn Undead since it requires some investment to really pop off, and scaring away enemies is always a gamble- unless your DM is ok with the Divine Feats from Complete Divine, including the dreaded Divine Metamagic, as these let you transmute your Turn attempts into other benefits.

The melee build requires self-buffing, which can be hard to pull off in some games without Divine Metamagic + Persist Spell, since a lot of times by the time you realize you're in a fight, you're giving up valuable turns to do this. And the last time I played 3.5, I went pure support and basically broke the game by powering up the team by a good 20% across the board and plinking enemies with a Reserve Feat unless I really needed to heal someone. Which was a lot of fun for everyone but the DM, as it happened.

A lot depends on the power level of the game, and how much optimization your DM is comfortable with. If both of those are average, I'd suggest a secondary melee role, with just enough Wisdom to cast spells and lots of Strength and Constitution. Wear the heavy armor, and use a reach weapon- as a Cleric you can use a longspear. This lets you attack from behind the melee, provide flanking from a distance, and if an enemy closes with you, they typically provoke an opportunity attack for a free hit. This lets you help out and be relatively close for a quick heal if needed in combat.

Cast Bless in big fights, Aid and Bull's Strength are great early. Prayer isn't the greatest buff, but in a long fight it adds up. You want to avoid spells that require saving throws for the most part.

There is an archer Cleric build but it requires more work and you still need to wade into melee range to use healing in combat. I'm not a fan of most Cleric prestige classes; you can suffer a hit to your Base Attack Bonus if you're not careful, and they tend to treat you more like a full caster than a hybrid class- unless you're going for turn attempts and then there's Radiant Servant of Pelor.

A lot of your spell list consists of "bad thing happened to ally/remove bad thing". You'll be expected to have these available at all times, and they aren't generally useful otherwise, so you might not be doing a lot of casting. This does change when you start looking in other books, as a great many interesting spells are added to the class list, but again, the more you diversify, the less ability you have to deal with fatigue, ability damage, poison, disease, curses, and all that fun stuff people expect from a Cleric.

If you do decide to use your magic for other things, you really should ask your party if they are ok with that; there are quite a lot of terrible things that can happen to a character outside of hit point loss. Out of combat healing should be accomplished with a Wand of Cure Light Wounds (Or Lesser Vigor, if available). You can invest in Scribe Scroll if you want to have utility spells on hand to use as needed. I would avoid Craft Wondrous Item- this is a very powerful Feat, if your DM gives you reasonable gold and some downtime. So powerful, that it can break the game's economy and make you and your allies far stronger for your level than intended.

OTOH, without ample gold or time, it's literally a dead Feat.

 

[DarkMoon250]

There's a few ways to build a Cleric in 3.5. You can build yourself for melee superiority or ally support fairly easily. I wouldn't bother with Turn Undead since it requires some investment to really pop off, and scaring away enemies is always a gamble- unless your DM is ok with the Divine Feats from Complete Divine, including the dreaded Divine Metamagic, as these let you transmute your Turn attempts into other benefits.

The melee build requires self-buffing, which can be hard to pull off in some games without Divine Metamagic + Persist Spell, since a lot of times by the time you realize you're in a fight, you're giving up valuable turns to do this. And the last time I played 3.5, I went pure support and basically broke the game by powering up the team by a good 20% across the board and plinking enemies with a Reserve Feat unless I really needed to heal someone. Which was a lot of fun for everyone but the DM, as it happened.

A lot depends on the power level of the game, and how much optimization your DM is comfortable with. If both of those are average, I'd suggest a secondary melee role, with just enough Wisdom to cast spells and lots of Strength and Constitution. Wear the heavy armor, and use a reach weapon- as a Cleric you can use a longspear. This lets you attack from behind the melee, provide flanking from a distance, and if an enemy closes with you, they typically provoke an opportunity attack for a free hit. This lets you help out and be relatively close for a quick heal if needed in combat.

Cast Bless in big fights, Aid and Bull's Strength are great early. Prayer isn't the greatest buff, but in a long fight it adds up. You want to avoid spells that require saving throws for the most part.

There is an archer Cleric build but it requires more work and you still need to wade into melee range to use healing in combat. I'm not a fan of most Cleric prestige classes; you can suffer a hit to your Base Attack Bonus if you're not careful, and they tend to treat you more like a full caster than a hybrid class- unless you're going for turn attempts and then there's Radiant Servant of Pelor.

A lot of your spell list consists of "bad thing happened to ally/remove bad thing". You'll be expected to have these available at all times, and they aren't generally useful otherwise, so you might not be doing a lot of casting. This does change when you start looking in other books, as a great many interesting spells are added to the class list, but again, the more you diversify, the less ability you have to deal with fatigue, ability damage, poison, disease, curses, and all that fun stuff people expect from a Cleric.

If you do decide to use your magic for other things, you really should ask your party if they are ok with that; there are quite a lot of terrible things that can happen to a character outside of hit point loss. Out of combat healing should be accomplished with a Wand of Cure Light Wounds (Or Lesser Vigor, if available). You can invest in Scribe Scroll if you want to have utility spells on hand to use as needed. I would avoid Craft Wondrous Item- this is a very powerful Feat, if your DM gives you reasonable gold and some downtime. So powerful, that it can break the game's economy and make you and your allies far stronger for your level than intended.

OTOH, without ample gold or time, it's literally a dead Feat.

Thanks for the advice. All core books are allowed, so I can pull from Complete Divine and Complete Champion.

Any suggestions for the race I should choose?

 

[James Gasik]

Thanks for the advice. All core books are allowed, so I can pull from Complete Divine and Complete Champion.

Any suggestions for the race I should choose?

As much as I hate to say it, probably Human. You don't get tons of skill points, or Feats, and even if you don't use turn undead much, penalizing Charisma is probably not the way to go (Half-Orc or Dwarf). Any race that would give you a bonus to Strength, Constitution, or Wisdom (your three best stats most likely) comes with a penalty somewhere else you probably wouldn't want, or a level adjustment, which is almost assuredly not something you want.

 

[DarkMoon250]

As much as I hate to say it, probably Human. You don't get tons of skill points, or Feats, and even if you don't use turn undead much, penalizing Charisma is probably not the way to go (Half-Orc or Dwarf). Any race that would give you a bonus to Strength, Constitution, or Wisdom (your three best stats most likely) comes with a penalty somewhere else you probably wouldn't want, or a level adjustment, which is almost assuredly not something you want.

3 questions:

1. Despite LA, could an aasimar be worth it if LA buyoff is allowed? Because that is a rule the DM has confirmed will be in this game.
2. What bloodlines from UA or templates (on a human) might be useful for this stat set or for a buffing build? Are there any good templates that won't be too much of a hassle to buy off?
3. Would you suggest I start as a middle aged character, for a -1 on physical stats and a +1 on mental stats?

 

[James Gasik]

3 questions:

1. Despite LA, could an aasimar be worth it if LA buyoff is allowed? Because that is a rule the DM has confirmed will be in this game.
2. What bloodlines from UA or templates (on a human) might be useful for this stat set or for a buffing build? Are there any good templates that won't be too much of a hassle to buy off?
3. Would you suggest I start as a middle aged character, for a -1 on physical stats and a +1 on mental stats?

LA Buyoff is a good system, but you will be behind somewhat early on as a result. The question really comes down to, what are you getting from it, and is it worth the xp? In this case, you get darkvision, minor resistances, +2 Wis, +2 Cha, and the occasional "oh this spell doesn't work because I'm not a humanoid".

Ironically, these advantages are better early in your career; later on, you can easily get magic items that increase an ability score, or provide the ability to see in the dark (not goggles of night though, they are overpriced. Continual Light on a burned-out ioun stone however is fairly cheap). Need better turning checks? Circle of Persuasion is a bargain. Need more turning attempts? Nightsticks from Libris Mortis (I think, it's been awhile).

As for Bloodlines, no. They are a trap. You have to pay up front with a mostly useless bloodline level for benefits you get later, and only the Major Bloodlines give you abilities worth noting.

If you want to be a caster cleric, and the option to start older is on the table...there's probably not much reason not to. But do remember some very important spells on your list are touch range. So you are going to need to get close to enemies to cast, and penalties to Strength can make it harder to wear armor (and harder to smack something in melee if you want to conserve spells), as well as reduce your hit points and Concentration checks.

Further, even though they attack touch AC, some of your offensive spells require a touch attack, and that is Strength-based (a minor penalty, but it's worth noting).

 

[DarkMoon250]

LA Buyoff is a good system, but you will be behind somewhat early on as a result. The question really comes down to, what are you getting from it, and is it worth the xp? In this case, you get darkvision, minor resistances, +2 Wis, +2 Cha, and the occasional "oh this spell doesn't work because I'm not a humanoid".

Ironically, these advantages are better early in your career; later on, you can easily get magic items that increase an ability score, or provide the ability to see in the dark (not goggles of night though, they are overpriced. Continual Light on a burned-out ioun stone however is fairly cheap). Need better turning checks? Circle of Persuasion is a bargain. Need more turning attempts? Nightsticks from Libris Mortis (I think, it's been awhile).

As for Bloodlines, no. They are a trap. You have to pay up front with a mostly useless bloodline level for benefits you get later, and only the Major Bloodlines give you abilities worth noting.

If you want to be a caster cleric, and the option to start older is on the table...there's probably not much reason not to. But do remember some very important spells on your list are touch range. So you are going to need to get close to enemies to cast, and penalties to Strength can make it harder to wear armor (and harder to smack something in melee if you want to conserve spells), as well as reduce your hit points and Concentration checks.

Further, even though they attack touch AC, some of your offensive spells require a touch attack, and that is Strength-based (a minor penalty, but it's worth noting).

In that case, are there any templates a human might benefit from? I just don't feel like playing a normal, regular human dude. Or could lesser aasimar offer some good options without needing LA buyoff?

Also, is it even worth it to cast melee touch attack spells or to use some form of weapon with my stats? With middle age or without it, I'm only going to have a +1 to Str.

Also also, based on what's been discussed so far, which of the deities that I'm interested in might offer the best domains for where this build seems to be heading?

 

[DarkMoon250]

This just in, I have been informed that I may use a 28 point-buy if I would like.

 

[James Gasik]

In that case, are there any templates a human might benefit from? I just don't feel like playing a normal, regular human dude. Or could lesser aasimar offer some good options without needing LA buyoff?

Also, is it even worth it to cast melee touch attack spells or to use some form of weapon with my stats? With middle age or without it, I'm only going to have a +1 to Str.

Also also, based on what's been discussed so far, which of the deities that I'm interested in might offer the best domains for where this build seems to be heading?

If Lesser Aasimar is allowed, then that's fine, you aren't giving anything up really. And as for the attack bonus, if you're determined to be older, then no, it's probably not worth it. This is doing to mean that you should go hunting for a Reserve Feat to use (fiery burst is a favorite of mine) because you'll need to lean heavily on your spell list to find something to do each turn, which will cause you to run out of spells faster. You may need Reach Spell at some point. At level 1, Command and Inhibit are decent spells to ruin enemy action economy. At level 2, you can use Frost Breath or Sound Burst. Damage isn't great, but daze and stun are good conditions. Level 3 gets you Darkfire and Mark of Doom.

As for Domains, I would suggest Fire to be one of them. There's some offense there, and good spells to feed Fiery Burst if you want to go that route. Glory is great if you're going to the Turn Undead route. Travel is an all-time favorite, Magic gives you a nice ability to use Wizard scrolls.

If you do end up getting Divine Metamagic, Planning or Time are probably must haves.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Some see Reserve feats as less optimal/underpowered choices, but I think they’re great for flavor and a subtle but useful mechanical advantage that isn’t easily nullified. And they’re a good RP hook as well.

I would only use the Bloodlines for RP reasons. If I’m trying some oddball species, I’d rather just deal with the LA adjustment.

Templates were a good idea, but the designers didn’t do the best job calculating the costs for all of them. Still, they can be a great source of fresh mechanical and role playing experiences, if allowed.

 

[Grogg of the North]

@DarkMoon250 The stats you rolled are equivalent of 34 points. So it's up to you if you want to keep them or not.

Do you know anymore about the campaign? What types of enemies you'll be facing? I assume the fighter and paladin are going to be melee? Can you tell us anything else about your character? Have you settled on a deity?

For races, you really can't go wrong with any of them. As long as you're not taking a hit to Wisdom. The only ones I wouldn't recommend in the PHB are Half-Elf (always thought they were kinda "meh") and Half-Orc (the hit to your mental stats hurts).

I saw that you were allowed Core books (PHB and DMG?) along with Complete Divine and Complete Champion. What about Complete Warrior, Adventurer, Arcane, and Mage?

One of my personal favorites is the Reach Spell feat (Complete Divine) coupled with Divine Metamagic (Also Complete Divine). If the fighter goes down, you don't have to worry about rushing across the battlefield to save him. Big bad monster with a beat stick? Bestow Curse from outside his reach.

I saw that there was talk about about being an archer. Zen Archery (Complete Warrior) would let you use your wisdom to attack with a longbow. However, you're going to need, at a minimum, Point Blank Shot and Precise Shot. If you're not an elf, then you need Martial Weapon Proficiency (Longbow) on top of it.

Turning, in my opinion, is useless. You need to find other ways to use those turn attempts. Either Divine Metamagic or the various feats that let you spend a turn attempt for X affect. Divine Metamagic (Persist) is the elephant in the room. If you can use Nightsticks (Libris Mortis) to power Divine Metamagic then the feat is crazy broken. If not, then you probably only have enough turning attempts to persist one spell and it's much more reasonable.

The cleric is a very flexible class. But it also can require a lot of feats. And it is very easy to be feat starved in 3.5.

Roles for your cleric:

• De/Buff Bot - Make your allies even better and your enemies weaker. As you get higher level you can add in Save or Lose/Suck spells to your arsenal. There are many Divine Feats in Complete Warrior and Complete Divine that work great for buffing the party. They give small amounts of fast healing and energy resistance.
• Summoner - Clerics make great summoners. Some GMs may get overwhelmed with additional combatants added to the field. If you get the Animal Domain, you can expand your summoning options with Summon Nature's Ally. You can also use the Spontaneous Summoner feat (Complete Divine) to give you a little bit of flexibility in how you prepare a spell list. You're going to need Augment Summoning, Spell Focus (Conjuration), and probably Rapid Spell to make the most of being a summoner. For extra craziness, look at Malconvoker in Complete Scoundrel. Summon lots of evil things to fight other evil things!
• Heal Bot - Be a box of a band aids. It isn't really efficient though and kinda boring. As you level up, monsters will continue to out pace your healing with their damage. For things like Remove Curse/Disease/Blindness, they come up so rarely that you may want to pick up a scroll or potion. If you really want to go down this path, look at Radiant Servant of Pelor in Complete Divine. It makes being a healer viable.

I think we need a little more information from you on character concept or ideas to get the most assistance. Hopefully I can clear the cobwebs off my 3.5 knowledge and be of more help.

 

[DarkMoon250]

@DarkMoon250 The stats you rolled are equivalent of 34 points. So it's up to you if you want to keep them or not.

Do you know anymore about the campaign? What types of enemies you'll be facing? I assume the fighter and paladin are going to be melee? Can you tell us anything else about your character? Have you settled on a deity?

For races, you really can't go wrong with any of them. As long as you're not taking a hit to Wisdom. The only ones I wouldn't recommend in the PHB are Half-Elf (always thought they were kinda "meh") and Half-Orc (the hit to your mental stats hurts).

I saw that you were allowed Core books (PHB and DMG?) along with Complete Divine and Complete Champion. What about Complete Warrior, Adventurer, Arcane, and Mage?

One of my personal favorites is the Reach Spell feat (Complete Divine) coupled with Divine Metamagic (Also Complete Divine). If the fighter goes down, you don't have to worry about rushing across the battlefield to save him. Big bad monster with a beat stick? Bestow Curse from outside his reach.

I saw that there was talk about about being an archer. Zen Archery (Complete Warrior) would let you use your wisdom to attack with a longbow. However, you're going to need, at a minimum, Point Blank Shot and Precise Shot. If you're not an elf, then you need Martial Weapon Proficiency (Longbow) on top of it.

Turning, in my opinion, is useless. You need to find other ways to use those turn attempts. Either Divine Metamagic or the various feats that let you spend a turn attempt for X affect. Divine Metamagic (Persist) is the elephant in the room. If you can use Nightsticks (Libris Mortis) to power Divine Metamagic then the feat is crazy broken. If not, then you probably only have enough turning attempts to persist one spell and it's much more reasonable.

The cleric is a very flexible class. But it also can require a lot of feats. And it is very easy to be feat starved in 3.5.

Roles for your cleric:

• De/Buff Bot - Make your allies even better and your enemies weaker. As you get higher level you can add in Save or Lose/Suck spells to your arsenal. There are many Divine Feats in Complete Warrior and Complete Divine that work great for buffing the party. They give small amounts of fast healing and energy resistance.
• Summoner - Clerics make great summoners. Some GMs may get overwhelmed with additional combatants added to the field. If you get the Animal Domain, you can expand your summoning options with Summon Nature's Ally. You can also use the Spontaneous Summoner feat (Complete Divine) to give you a little bit of flexibility in how you prepare a spell list. You're going to need Augment Summoning, Spell Focus (Conjuration), and probably Rapid Spell to make the most of being a summoner. For extra craziness, look at Malconvoker in Complete Scoundrel. Summon lots of evil things to fight other evil things!
• Heal Bot - Be a box of a band aids. It isn't really efficient though and kinda boring. As you level up, monsters will continue to out pace your healing with their damage. For things like Remove Curse/Disease/Blindness, they come up so rarely that you may want to pick up a scroll or potion. If you really want to go down this path, look at Radiant Servant of Pelor in Complete Divine. It makes being a healer viable.

I think we need a little more information from you on character concept or ideas to get the most assistance. Hopefully I can clear the cobwebs off my 3.5 knowledge and be of more help.

The deities I was hoping for my Cleric to worship are either Selune (if human or aasimar), Sehanine Moonbow (if elven), or Tuilviel Glithien (if raptoran; from Races of the Wild). These are all deities associated with the night sky and the influence of the moon in some form or another, and that's exactly the vibe I was wanting for this character. My character is a member of a church that affirms the unity of all divine powers as emanations of the Allgod, but is working as an independent spiritual guide after becoming suspicious of the motives of some of the more influential members of the High Council.

The campaign is a sandboxy sort, where we get to choose how the campaign progresses. The DM has described the overall shape of it as 25% combat and 75% RP, though. Also, in the setting, there is a country of intelligent undead, which, as far as the outside world knows, could be either a paradise for good and neutral undead, or a global horror show just waiting to happen.

Alongside CD and CC, all other core books are allowed.

Also, raptoran has some substitute levels for Cleric that increase their summoning prowess in regards to air elementals, in exchange for combat prowess and a restriction against other kinds of summons. It also leads into the Skypledged prestige class. Could that possibly be worth looking into?

 

[Grogg of the North]

Raptoran:
Raptoran is an interesting race. No LA with a slowly scaling flight speed. Flight can either make things trivial (flying across a pit) or be a pain in the butt (what do you mean I don't have room for my wingspan? I'm a five foot cube!). Sky domain synergizes well with the race, too. The other racial benefits are ok. A boost to jump checks eventually gets replaced with flight. Pact of the Wind Lords gives a boost your caster level for (air) spells but there are very few spells with the air descriptor. I would be surprised if this ever came up. Unerring Direction is a neat roleplay ability but five ranks in survival gives you the same effect. Lastly, you get footbow as a martial weapon instead of an exotic weapon. But clerics don't get martial weapons so it isn't doing you any favors there. If you want a footbow, you're going to need to burn a feat. But if you're burning a feat, you might as well get longbow since you're more likely to find that as loot or be able to buy one in a city somewhere.

The cleric substitution levels are nice and flavorful but they aren't doing you any favors if you take the Skypledged prestige class. Many of the substitution levels' features overlap with the prestige class. I would probably pass on the substitution levels.

Skypledged is a neat prestige class. The spellpool ability would be handy for dealing with situations where you need a spell but don't want to always have it prepared. Things like curses, poison, or disease. Just be sure to have some downtime to repay your debt to the spellpool. The summons are a nice touch and it's always helpful to have a friend you can call on. If you make it all the way and get Cyclonic Doom, be sure to ask your GM if it affects ranged attacks; if enemy, or your, arrows get blown away. Lastly, I don't know how much the Beckon Winds feature will be useful but, again, really nice and flavorful.

The domain choices for Tuilveil are all ok. Nothing great; nothing awful. Sky Domain is the exception since it synergizes well with Raptoran.

Elf:
Elf is always a solid pick but you have to be careful with that -2 Con. Elves automatically get longbow proficiency and the elf domain would give you point blank shot for free, too. Pick up Precise Shot at Level 1 and you're an effective archer! Pew pew pew! If you want to be an archer, you're pretty much pushed into this race/deity.

Elf domain does have some nice spells in it, adding variety to the cleric spell list. However, true strike is a bit of a trap. Spend this turn to hit something next turn. Maybe if you're setting up an ambush would that be useful. Sehanine also has Travel and Trickery domains, which are awesome! Repose is basically a non-evil death domain. Moon would be great for fighting werewolves. Knowledge and Oracle are very similar in granted abilities and spell lists. I would pass on Dream Domain, too. Immunity to fear is easy to come by otherwise, especially if you're starting at high(er) level.

Human:
What to say about human? Extra feats and skill points are always welcome.

Aasimar:
If you're not using level adjustment buy off, I would avoid Aasimar. Giving up caster levels is not always a good idea. The paladin's spell list is going to be very limited. And the sorcerer is going to be limited by spells known. Cleric allows you to be versatile with spell selection. But the question is, do you want to get the next level of spells a level up later?

With that being said, the bump to Wisdom and Charisma works well for cleric. You can cast light once a day but also have darkvision. So that's kind of a moot point. Elemental resistances are nice but you will be able to surpass them quickly enough when you get things like Resist Energy, Mass. One neat thing though is that if go somewhere extremely cold, those resistances will let you avoid making saves vs cold damage from the environment. (See Frostburn!) As a native outsider, you can avoid things like Charm Person but you also can't benefit from things like Enlarge Person. Sadly, I don't think there is an Enlarge Monster spell. So, maybe a slight advantage in your favor.

For Human or Aasimar, I like the Chastity Domain from Selune. The Night domain gives Human some nice bonuses but not so much to the Aasimar. The spell selection on Night Domain is good, too. Lastly, Selune has Travel Domain, which I am a fan of.

All of these are solid options. I think I would break it down like this:

Do I want to fly around? - Raptoran Cleric of Tuilveil (And maybe prestige into Skypledged)
Do I want to be an archer? - Elf cleric of Sehanine
Neither of those? Human Cleric of Selune (Summoner or whatever)

In the end, remember this is YOUR character. Pick what you think is going to be fun and interesting. You don't have to listen to the random ravings of some guy on the internet. But I really do hope this helped you make a decision.

 

[DarkMoon250]

Raptoran:
Raptoran is an interesting race. No LA with a slowly scaling flight speed. Flight can either make things trivial (flying across a pit) or be a pain in the butt (what do you mean I don't have room for my wingspan? I'm a five foot cube!). Sky domain synergizes well with the race, too. The other racial benefits are ok. A boost to jump checks eventually gets replaced with flight. Pact of the Wind Lords gives a boost your caster level for (air) spells but there are very few spells with the air descriptor. I would be surprised if this ever came up. Unerring Direction is a neat roleplay ability but five ranks in survival gives you the same effect. Lastly, you get footbow as a martial weapon instead of an exotic weapon. But clerics don't get martial weapons so it isn't doing you any favors there. If you want a footbow, you're going to need to burn a feat. But if you're burning a feat, you might as well get longbow since you're more likely to find that as loot or be able to buy one in a city somewhere.

The cleric substitution levels are nice and flavorful but they aren't doing you any favors if you take the Skypledged prestige class. Many of the substitution levels' features overlap with the prestige class. I would probably pass on the substitution levels.

Skypledged is a neat prestige class. The spellpool ability would be handy for dealing with situations where you need a spell but don't want to always have it prepared. Things like curses, poison, or disease. Just be sure to have some downtime to repay your debt to the spellpool. The summons are a nice touch and it's always helpful to have a friend you can call on. If you make it all the way and get Cyclonic Doom, be sure to ask your GM if it affects ranged attacks; if enemy, or your, arrows get blown away. Lastly, I don't know how much the Beckon Winds feature will be useful but, again, really nice and flavorful.

The domain choices for Tuilveil are all ok. Nothing great; nothing awful. Sky Domain is the exception since it synergizes well with Raptoran.

Elf:
Elf is always a solid pick but you have to be careful with that -2 Con. Elves automatically get longbow proficiency and the elf domain would give you point blank shot for free, too. Pick up Precise Shot at Level 1 and you're an effective archer! Pew pew pew! If you want to be an archer, you're pretty much pushed into this race/deity.

Elf domain does have some nice spells in it, adding variety to the cleric spell list. However, true strike is a bit of a trap. Spend this turn to hit something next turn. Maybe if you're setting up an ambush would that be useful. Sehanine also has Travel and Trickery domains, which are awesome! Repose is basically a non-evil death domain. Moon would be great for fighting werewolves. Knowledge and Oracle are very similar in granted abilities and spell lists. I would pass on Dream Domain, too. Immunity to fear is easy to come by otherwise, especially if you're starting at high(er) level.

Human:
What to say about human? Extra feats and skill points are always welcome.

Aasimar:
If you're not using level adjustment buy off, I would avoid Aasimar. Giving up caster levels is not always a good idea. The paladin's spell list is going to be very limited. And the sorcerer is going to be limited by spells known. Cleric allows you to be versatile with spell selection. But the question is, do you want to get the next level of spells a level up later?

With that being said, the bump to Wisdom and Charisma works well for cleric. You can cast light once a day but also have darkvision. So that's kind of a moot point. Elemental resistances are nice but you will be able to surpass them quickly enough when you get things like Resist Energy, Mass. One neat thing though is that if go somewhere extremely cold, those resistances will let you avoid making saves vs cold damage from the environment. (See Frostburn!) As a native outsider, you can avoid things like Charm Person but you also can't benefit from things like Enlarge Person. Sadly, I don't think there is an Enlarge Monster spell. So, maybe a slight advantage in your favor.

For Human or Aasimar, I like the Chastity Domain from Selune. The Night domain gives Human some nice bonuses but not so much to the Aasimar. The spell selection on Night Domain is good, too. Lastly, Selune has Travel Domain, which I am a fan of.

All of these are solid options. I think I would break it down like this:

Do I want to fly around? - Raptoran Cleric of Tuilveil (And maybe prestige into Skypledged)
Do I want to be an archer? - Elf cleric of Sehanine
Neither of those? Human Cleric of Selune (Summoner or whatever)

In the end, remember this is YOUR character. Pick what you think is going to be fun and interesting. You don't have to listen to the random ravings of some guy on the internet. But I really do hope this helped you make a decision.

This was very helpful! Thank you very much!
Also, we are using LA buyoff, in case that affects your opinion about the aasimar.

 

[Grogg of the North]

What level are you starting at? I saw you have a hefty amount of gold to play with so I'm assuming higher than first level.

If you can start off with your Level Adjustment already gone, then Aasmir is a lot more appealing (Less bookkeeping ). Even if you can't, assuming you start a level behind everyone else, you'll rapidly catch up after "paying" for your level adjustment. The stat boosts work well with cleric since you'll need wisdom for spells and charisma for turning. And if the game is going to have a lot of social interaction, having a good charisma score will definitely help. The other racial bits are neat as I said earlier. With the exception of Light 1/day. Just seems silly to add that on when you have darkvision. Plus, you get that celestial flavor to go with your PC!

EDIT:
So it turns out you get Daylight and not Light. I was wrong there. Daylight is much more useful.

Also, ask your GM. As a Native Outsider, you may also get automatic proficiency in all simple and martial weapons, armor, and shields. You get the armor and shields from cleric, but maybe you can wield a longsword now. Or a longbow. It's kind of a nebulous gray area since Aasimar don't have racial hit dice. But it never hurts to ask.

 

[DarkMoon250]

What level are you starting at? I saw you have a hefty amount of gold to play with so I'm assuming higher than first level.

If you can start off with your Level Adjustment already gone, then Aasmir is a lot more appealing (Less bookkeeping ). Even if you can't, assuming you start a level behind everyone else, you'll rapidly catch up after "paying" for your level adjustment. The stat boosts work well with cleric since you'll need wisdom for spells and charisma for turning. And if the game is going to have a lot of social interaction, having a good charisma score will definitely help. The other racial bits are neat as I said earlier. With the exception of Light 1/day. Just seems silly to add that on when you have darkvision. Plus, you get that celestial flavor to go with your PC!

EDIT:
So it turns out you get Daylight and not Light. I was wrong there. Daylight is much more useful.

Also, ask your GM. As a Native Outsider, you may also get automatic proficiency in all simple and martial weapons, armor, and shields. You get the armor and shields from cleric, but maybe you can wield a longsword now. Or a longbow. It's kind of a nebulous gray area since Aasimar don't have racial hit dice. But it never hurts to ask.

Our starting level is 5.

Also, do you have any idea of what kind of stats an elf archer Cleric would want to have, just in case I go that route? We are currently lacking any ranged character, so I'm still considering that route.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

A ranged attacking cleric needs Dex, Wis, and Cha as his main stats, and should probably take Reach Spell ASAP. Not only will that feat let you deliver touch range attack/debuff spells, but also touch buff/heal spells as well. That maximizes the time you spend out of harm’s way.

From an optimizing standpoint, that kind of build almost demands you should go Elf or Human for the benefits of the Elf Domain or bonus feats.

And that brings me back to the suggestion I made in your prior thread about the Knowledge Domain and the Knowledge Devotion feat. Being able to pump your Att/Dam +1-+5 for almost every opponent you face is nothing to sneeze at.