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Message: <blockquote data-quote="MerricB" data-source="post: 5719343" data-attributes="member: 3586">The big difference is that 3E combats became unwieldy once 12th level was cleared. It has been noted that I run combats a lot quicker than most DMs, and even my high-level 3E combats were taking 1-3 hours. (Very rarely 3). The amount of time it took a fighter to resolve his turn was ridiculous - so many dice being rolled, and then modifier after modifier after modifier...3E provides more wacky effects in combat from the spellcasters, especially once they get their hands on books like the Spell Compendium. There are fewer "way-out-there" moments with 4e, although there are lovely moments. Our wizard had the ability to banish a foe to a demiplane (for a turn) on a critical, which was pretty amusing for everyone...One big feature of 4E was how all the characters were relevant throughout. We didn't have a final combat where the rogue was reduced to doing 3 damage to the Big Bad because of Epic Damage Resistance + No Sneak Attack (which is what Paizo inflicted on us with Kyuss). The cleric was more effective against undead; the wizard more effective against minions - or at controlling solos; the fighter was always appreciated and the thief likewise.Mathematically, the original incarnation of 4E had problems at the higher levels, which mostly translated to too little damage from monsters (and some too-high defenses). Luckily, most of my epic run was after the new maths, so I just upped damage codes. They might still be a little low - it's incredible the healing power the party has - but they're a lot better.Another interesting point: start of turn auras got replaced by end of turn effects in new monster/trap + spell design. This is so, so much better. In Kingdom of Ghouls, we had a monster that blinded and dazed anyone who started in its aura. (Ghoul Gatherer). It was the most stupidly frustrating monster to play against. There wasn't an escape option for the wizard - it could just hunt him down each turn. Noting the change in design philosophy, I switched it to end of turn, and suddenly it became an interesting monster rather than a frustrating one. (It also turns out that Splug rolled *more* criticals when he was blind...)The actual structure of the H-P-E adventures didn't allow much ritual use - there was some, but rarely was it needed. I've noticed a *lot* more ritual use in the running of the sandbox-y "Lost City" adventure (which is really worth checking out - it's Logan Bonner + others from the Open Design initiative). Rituals do need work, mostly on a cost basis.Mordenkainen's Magic Emporium is brilliant, and has much better magic items that what came before - it was much easier to give the party items from it th appreciated than a lot of lackluster ones from the AVs. Basically, I think 4E has become a lot better recently post-essentials: although it was fun before, it did show all the signs of a system not understood enough; pretty much the same as 3e, although the fundamentals of 3e/3.5e are just so flawed that after a while you can't fix them. Don't get me wrong, I like 3e/3.5e, but at higher levels the gaping holes in the system are a lot more problematic than any with 4e.There are things I'd still like 4e to do better, but just at this point I'm very happy with how the campaign went.Going forward, my other 4E campaign (Greyhawk) is about 15th level and exploring the Lost City, I'm playing in a 7th level Eberron game, and I'm hoping the Sunday game will now try some AD&D, so we can get some perspective on how D&D has changed - and see if the faster combats make up for the simpler characters.Cheers!</blockquote>

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