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<blockquote data-quote="ledded" data-source="post: 1859220" data-attributes="member: 12744">Some really good rules suggestions (scribbling for future reference) and discussion here.&nbsp;Not to add too much fuel to the slightly off-topic, but you also have to take into effect other factors in the decline of armor.&nbsp; For instance, as European armies (in general) grew larger on the battlefield from the middle ages onward, the cost of outfitting and training the men grew in proportion, so economy grew to affect this change.&nbsp; Just one of many (admittedly arguable) factors, point being that firearms alone did not doom armor.&nbsp; Just as today, high-powered rifles have not doomed most types of body armor for military/law enforcement occupations, even though few of the ones in use can truly stop a high-powered rifle round.&nbsp;I've read several anecdotes of the varying firepower of a breech-loaded wheellock/flintlock, and even the quality of the coase powder affecting a shot.&nbsp; There was one instance where a Scotsman actually took a pistol shot to the bare forehead in a duel and it bounced off, stunning him and leaving a &quot;goose-egg&quot; sized lump, but otherwise unharmed.&nbsp; In a similar story, an anecdote from the English Civil War detailed how a back-and-breast wearing cavalryman was shot at approximately 50 yards, the round piercing the front and back of his armor leaving a hole over &quot;two-fingers thick&quot; and killing him instantly.&nbsp; So there are widely varying individual accounts, earlier firearms being susceptible to a wide variety of variables that could affect their power.&nbsp; That is of course difficult to model in a game, but worth considering nonetheless.&nbsp;As far as proofing is concerned, I even have evidence of breastplates made and sold as late as during the american civil war (in Harpers, no less) that were sold as 'proofed', and were occasionally worn by officers that could afford them.&nbsp; One in particular that I've seen a photograph of was reported to have saved a particular union colonel's life by deflecting musket rounds several times with minimal injury, though he was eventually killed charging a cannon position when the breastplate in question was obviously not up to stopping a grapeshot blast at close range.&nbsp; Not in widespread use by any means, and generally frowned upon as 'unsporting', but they did exist.&nbsp; I have the reference book at home that I can get further information from if anyone wants.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="ledded, post: 1859220, member: 12744"] Some really good rules suggestions (scribbling for future reference) and discussion here. Not to add too much fuel to the slightly off-topic, but you also have to take into effect other factors in the decline of armor. For instance, as European armies (in general) grew larger on the battlefield from the middle ages onward, the cost of outfitting and training the men grew in proportion, so economy grew to affect this change. Just one of many (admittedly arguable) factors, point being that firearms alone did not doom armor. Just as today, high-powered rifles have not doomed most types of body armor for military/law enforcement occupations, even though few of the ones in use can truly stop a high-powered rifle round. I've read several anecdotes of the varying firepower of a breech-loaded wheellock/flintlock, and even the quality of the coase powder affecting a shot. There was one instance where a Scotsman actually took a pistol shot to the bare forehead in a duel and it [I]bounced off[/I], stunning him and leaving a "goose-egg" sized lump, but otherwise unharmed. In a similar story, an anecdote from the English Civil War detailed how a back-and-breast wearing cavalryman was shot at approximately 50 yards, the round piercing the front and back of his armor leaving a hole over "two-fingers thick" and killing him instantly. So there are widely varying individual accounts, earlier firearms being susceptible to a wide variety of variables that could affect their power. That is of course difficult to model in a game, but worth considering nonetheless. As far as proofing is concerned, I even have evidence of breastplates made and sold as late as during the american civil war (in Harpers, no less) that were sold as 'proofed', and were occasionally worn by officers that could afford them. One in particular that I've seen a photograph of was reported to have saved a particular union colonel's life by deflecting musket rounds several times with minimal injury, though he was eventually killed charging a cannon position when the breastplate in question was obviously not up to stopping a grapeshot blast at close range. Not in widespread use by any means, and generally frowned upon as 'unsporting', but they did exist. I have the reference book at home that I can get further information from if anyone wants. [/QUOTE]

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