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General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
First experience with 5th edition and Lost Mines of Phandelver (no spoilers)
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<blockquote data-quote="Tony Vargas" data-source="post: 6880115" data-attributes="member: 996"><p>Sounds like every 3.5 fan's opinion of 5e that I've heard so far. Actually, that's higher praise than usual. 5e strives to accommodate a range of playstyles and fans of all prior editions. Perhaps more than any others (OSR is close), 3.5 fans have alternatives - particularly PF, obviously - to the current ed of D&D. </p><p></p><p>Nod. From the player's perspective, I empathize. As a DM, though, it's a feature. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink ;)" data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> </p><p></p><p>CHA is supposed to represent force of personality, doesn't sound like nonsense that it'd help you resist being dominated, for instance. STR, CON, DEX, & INT saves mostly make perfect sense. Where they don't, it's usually because two stats could really be involved, and they had to pick one. </p><p></p><p>Trying to make each stat relevant for every character isn't a bad design goal, either - it somewhat mediates against the temptation to 'dump' less relevant stats (like, notoriously, CHA). </p><p></p><p>Legendary monsters are pretty cool, but you won't see one for a while (the Unicorn is the lowest-level example, and not a typical foe for PCs). AC barely creeps at all (if anything, it's a little too static), but hit points can still go very high, as in 3e, you do get a HD & CON bonus at every level. Monster hps go very high, indeed. Bounded accuracy reduces 'number porn' like 1/level BAB paced by 'Natural' Armor bonuses, but it also reduces the sense of advancement - 5e makes it up in hps & damage, which scale pretty dramatically.</p><p></p><p>5e is explicitly 'balanced' around a 6-8 encounter/2-3 short rest 'day' so, yeah, a lot of combat. Less deadly combat, in general (it might not have seemed that way at 1st level), but more of it, with attrition over the day a bigger part of the focus.</p><p></p><p>A healer or three is a good particularly idea at 1st level. Life Clerics are better at it than Bards, too. 1st level has a very different feel, that way, from most of the rest of the game, and the exp charts are weighted to make your time spent at 1st & 2nd very brief. Exactly why - probably because it evokes the feel of the classic (pre-3.0) game, though I have a pet conspiracy theory that it's to create a first impression that the game is deadlier than it is, when it actually gets relatively 'easy' quite quickly.</p><p></p><p>Also a little odd - one of many ways, IMHO, that 5e looks to be aiming for long-time and returning fans more than new ones. (Though organized play /really/ seems to be trawling for new players, too, and starting at 1st may not be the best way, or at least has downsides - it's a balancing act, I guess.)</p><p></p><p>Anyway, we can cut Phandelver and HotDQ some slack because they were written even as encounter guidelines were being firmed up. HotDQ's early encounters can be quite deadly, for instance. Check out the DMBasic pdf for the encounter guidelines that should have been used, just for perspective, if you're interested.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Tony Vargas, post: 6880115, member: 996"] Sounds like every 3.5 fan's opinion of 5e that I've heard so far. Actually, that's higher praise than usual. 5e strives to accommodate a range of playstyles and fans of all prior editions. Perhaps more than any others (OSR is close), 3.5 fans have alternatives - particularly PF, obviously - to the current ed of D&D. Nod. From the player's perspective, I empathize. As a DM, though, it's a feature. ;) CHA is supposed to represent force of personality, doesn't sound like nonsense that it'd help you resist being dominated, for instance. STR, CON, DEX, & INT saves mostly make perfect sense. Where they don't, it's usually because two stats could really be involved, and they had to pick one. Trying to make each stat relevant for every character isn't a bad design goal, either - it somewhat mediates against the temptation to 'dump' less relevant stats (like, notoriously, CHA). Legendary monsters are pretty cool, but you won't see one for a while (the Unicorn is the lowest-level example, and not a typical foe for PCs). AC barely creeps at all (if anything, it's a little too static), but hit points can still go very high, as in 3e, you do get a HD & CON bonus at every level. Monster hps go very high, indeed. Bounded accuracy reduces 'number porn' like 1/level BAB paced by 'Natural' Armor bonuses, but it also reduces the sense of advancement - 5e makes it up in hps & damage, which scale pretty dramatically. 5e is explicitly 'balanced' around a 6-8 encounter/2-3 short rest 'day' so, yeah, a lot of combat. Less deadly combat, in general (it might not have seemed that way at 1st level), but more of it, with attrition over the day a bigger part of the focus. A healer or three is a good particularly idea at 1st level. Life Clerics are better at it than Bards, too. 1st level has a very different feel, that way, from most of the rest of the game, and the exp charts are weighted to make your time spent at 1st & 2nd very brief. Exactly why - probably because it evokes the feel of the classic (pre-3.0) game, though I have a pet conspiracy theory that it's to create a first impression that the game is deadlier than it is, when it actually gets relatively 'easy' quite quickly. Also a little odd - one of many ways, IMHO, that 5e looks to be aiming for long-time and returning fans more than new ones. (Though organized play /really/ seems to be trawling for new players, too, and starting at 1st may not be the best way, or at least has downsides - it's a balancing act, I guess.) Anyway, we can cut Phandelver and HotDQ some slack because they were written even as encounter guidelines were being firmed up. HotDQ's early encounters can be quite deadly, for instance. Check out the DMBasic pdf for the encounter guidelines that should have been used, just for perspective, if you're interested. [/QUOTE]
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