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<blockquote data-quote="Ruin Explorer" data-source="post: 9636549" data-attributes="member: 18">That's not just &quot;playing them smartly&quot;.That's &quot;assuming the players behave like total dunces and walk into a dark room without any caution&quot; and it's &quot;assuming the Mind Flayer's Perception and Stealth pay off&quot;, which like, they're not actually very high - +6 and +4 respectively (many PCs will have higher on both by L5). And what is the Mind Flayer doing, hanging out in the dark by himself? If he's heard them coming, maybe but even then it's far from a sure thing - a Rogue or similar might easily slip into the room without the Mind Flayer noticing, if you use the actual rules of the actual game.EDIT - I'm not speaking theoretically either - the main group I play with, the Rogue or similar is always at least 60' ahead of the party when they're in dangerous areas, and always operating &quot;dark&quot;, and usually has a pretty scary-high Stealth. The odds are good he finds the Mind Flayer before it finds them. Even with the dim-est 5E party I played with, they constantly sent familiars ahead to scout and carry lights and so on.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Ruin Explorer, post: 9636549, member: 18"] That's not [I]just[/I] "playing them smartly". That's "assuming the players behave like total dunces and walk into a dark room without any caution" and it's "assuming the Mind Flayer's Perception and Stealth pay off", which like, they're not actually very high - +6 and +4 respectively (many PCs will have higher on both by L5). And what is the Mind Flayer doing, hanging out in the dark by himself? If he's heard them coming, maybe but even then it's far from a sure thing - a Rogue or similar might easily slip into the room without the Mind Flayer noticing, if you use the actual rules of the actual game. EDIT - I'm not speaking theoretically either - the main group I play with, the Rogue or similar is always at least 60' ahead of the party when they're in dangerous areas, and always operating "dark", and usually has a pretty scary-high Stealth. The odds are good he finds the Mind Flayer before it finds them. Even with the dim-est 5E party I played with, they constantly sent familiars ahead to scout and carry lights and so on. [/QUOTE]

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