Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Flavor Mish-mash and favored classes (what 4e got wrong)
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="doctorhook" data-source="post: 4768737" data-attributes="member: 58401"><p>A lot of your criticisms are valid, and a lot of them aren't. (There's a lot of them, period.) A few of your criticisms seem to have missed the point altogether, like the criticisms of Half-Elf and Half-Orc ability bonuses. Other disagreements:</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Tieflings aren't universally distrusted or disliked, AFAIK.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Dwarves can be quite in-tune with the natural world, it's just one of stone and earth rather than leaves and bunny rabbits.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Dwarves, in fact, tend to make amazing Martial characters, thanks to their racial options and their minor action SW.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">"Primal feel" is pretty subjective.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Eladrins dig Wizardry and most other Arcana, so they can be forgiven for not being on about Warlock-ery.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Those "elves" which made such good Fighter/Mages in days past, they're called Eladrin now.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">What's wrong with Drow, Halfling, or Goblin Sorcerers?</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Why shouldn't Hobgoblins make good Bards?</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Why does being "savage", or even just being a Shifter mean that one couldn't be a good Cleric? A few of the gods like that.</li> </ul><p> OTOH, some of your points are good ones:</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Drow should make better Clerics and Wizards.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Kobolds should make good Sorcerers, especially Dragon Sorcerers.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Hobgoblins ought to succeed as Warlords at least as often as they do as Bards.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Tiefling probably should have made better Infernal Warlocks.</li> </ul><p>I think it's especially worth noting that you seem to heavily overstate the importance of racial stat bonuses, which aren't as big a deal as some will have you believe. This failure of your argument is especially obvious where you consider Dwarves not to make good Defenders.</p><p></p><p>Lastly, you assume that PCs represent the majority. In fact, perhaps most Tiefling Warlocks <em>do</em> follow the Infernal path, in spite of their bonuses.</p><p></p><p>Just some thoughts.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="doctorhook, post: 4768737, member: 58401"] A lot of your criticisms are valid, and a lot of them aren't. (There's a lot of them, period.) A few of your criticisms seem to have missed the point altogether, like the criticisms of Half-Elf and Half-Orc ability bonuses. Other disagreements: [LIST] [*]Tieflings aren't universally distrusted or disliked, AFAIK. [*]Dwarves can be quite in-tune with the natural world, it's just one of stone and earth rather than leaves and bunny rabbits. [*]Dwarves, in fact, tend to make amazing Martial characters, thanks to their racial options and their minor action SW. [*]"Primal feel" is pretty subjective. [*]Eladrins dig Wizardry and most other Arcana, so they can be forgiven for not being on about Warlock-ery. [*]Those "elves" which made such good Fighter/Mages in days past, they're called Eladrin now. [*]What's wrong with Drow, Halfling, or Goblin Sorcerers? [*]Why shouldn't Hobgoblins make good Bards? [*]Why does being "savage", or even just being a Shifter mean that one couldn't be a good Cleric? A few of the gods like that. [/LIST] OTOH, some of your points are good ones: [LIST] [*]Drow should make better Clerics and Wizards. [*]Kobolds should make good Sorcerers, especially Dragon Sorcerers. [*]Hobgoblins ought to succeed as Warlords at least as often as they do as Bards. [*]Tiefling probably should have made better Infernal Warlocks. [/LIST] I think it's especially worth noting that you seem to heavily overstate the importance of racial stat bonuses, which aren't as big a deal as some will have you believe. This failure of your argument is especially obvious where you consider Dwarves not to make good Defenders. Lastly, you assume that PCs represent the majority. In fact, perhaps most Tiefling Warlocks [I]do[/I] follow the Infernal path, in spite of their bonuses. Just some thoughts. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Flavor Mish-mash and favored classes (what 4e got wrong)
Top
