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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Herremann the Wise" data-source="post: 4481331" data-attributes="member: 11300">Provided they make their massive damage save (which has a whole heap of issues as well - I'm certainly not trying to imply that 3E was all sugar and spice and all things nice).Again the massive damage mechanic was the "patch" for this "bug".Ah, but without this divine aid, or even any aid, chances are the character is more than likely dead (although your chances of surviving at -1 are significantly better than surviving at -9).But as I answered you previously, while they can start an encounter the same as someone at full health, chances are they won't finish that encounter as "successfully" as the guy that was at full health - chances are that any serious encounter will leave them dead.Again, 3.x has its issues in not separating physical damage from all the other things that hit points are supposed to represent. As such, the 2 hit points of divine healing you are talking about is not an absolute measure. If they "heal" a 100hp fighter at 98hps 2 hit points, they have had almost no effect on his health. For a fighter at -1(dying), those same two orisons are the difference between consciousness and a possible trip to the afterlife. The orisons were far more "powerful" in the latter circumstance than the former.In 3E, If my character got knocked down to -7 to -9, I wouldn't bat an eyelid if the DMs description was something along the lines of..."the bolt sticking out of your eye REALLY hurts, you see everyone looking at you (with your good eye) in complete horror as you fall to the ground unconscious". I know that pretty much the only thing that's going to save his bacon is some instamatic healbot attention. In fact, such attention is going to be the only way that he's back up and in the frey once more in a handful of minutes.If the same thing happened in 4E (bolt through the eye is described by the DM, dropping him to -7 to -9 unconscious), then it would feel kind of weird to make my save, surge up after the combat and be back to full operation (as in my guy has a similar chance of surviving another encounter as the uninjured fighter over there). No divine assistance, just a little bit of heroic grit. I'd ask my DM about the whole bolt through the eye thing to which he'd most likely have to say - "nah, it was just a flesh wound". I'd roll my eyes, think of the Black Knight, chuckle at the game rules and then continue on.Best RegardsHerremann the Wise</blockquote>

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