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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Jay Verkuilen" data-source="post: 7750745" data-attributes="member: 6873517">Sort of. But it was one change among many. Yes, it did, and that goes back all the way to the beginning of the game to some degree. Again, yet another change. Hero is a totally different game family! Expectations in a totally different game are that, well, things are different. 4E purported to be the same game, new edition. Those seem like fairly marginal changes to me. I wasn't really making that argument per se. Things like the action economy and movement rules with the expectation that play would be on a grid, power choice being like deck building, much more defined roles that resemble character roles in MMOs, and so on, have all been mentioned alreadyI'm noting that 4E had many changes to D&D's core constructions. Each one on its own might have been... meh, OK. However, the sum total of the changes was very large. There were people who really loved those changes (you, presumably, several others here clearly) but a lot of folks felt they went too far in total, even if there were parts of it they liked. I cited the notion of the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Family_resemblance" target="_blank">family resemblance</a> before, with 4E clearly being quite a bit different from the rest of the D&D family. For another example not involving games, consider a longstanding band that's had an album that was markedly different in many ways from the prior albums. An established fanbase is often not happy in circumstances like these. There's an adage that a band rarely survives the departure of its lead singer. Or an established restaurant that was known as for good pub 'n grub all of a sudden deciding to shift focus to experimental haute cuisine. Of course there are examples to the contrary, but the general rule isn't a bad one: Shifting key aspects of an identity often alienate existing fans and often do not attract additional ones.</blockquote>

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