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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Black Knight Irios" data-source="post: 5975541" data-attributes="member: 8853">I can't say much about 2E but for 3.x the disparity starts to get greater with every level past 9, I'm probably rather generous with my estimation of level 9, might be as soon as level 7.For 4E that problem has been largely toned down b/c a Wizard (CLR/DRD) has not all spells that exist at his disposal but a select few and due to the removal of long term buffs and the reduction of the duration of the remaining utility spells.Back to 3E:The group setup WIZ+WIZ+CLR+DRD (or any other combination) was not an issue of imbalance among the players but a direct challenge to the DM.A group lacking all those classes was severly disadvantaged if the DM ran a standard adventure b/c they were lacking utility, protection and healing. A differnt kind of challenge for the DM.A group consisting of the aforementioned casters and non-casters was imbalanced regarding power levels among the players. A DM might be able alleviate the power disparity but I don't think that could be achieved within the rules by RAW.Fast foreward 5E:I hope that the wizard (other Vancian casters) regain some of their utility but at the same time I hope that all non-Vancian casters are buffed so that they can contribute more to the campaign not just combats than I swing my sword described in 318 different ways.</blockquote>